Condoleeza Rice/Colin Powell: the KKK's dream come true

[imgonnaeaturlunch]

Back when the KKK was lynching african-americans, the KKK could always depend on certain african-americans to tell them where to find the african-americans the KKK was looking to lynch. And when the Nazis were looking for Jews to kill, there were always certain Jews who told the Nazis where to find the Jews the Nazis were wanting to kill. And in Northern Ireland, when the British went looking for Catholics to kill, there were always certain Catholics who told the British where to find the Catholics the British wanted to kill. So I guess it shouldn't be any surprise that Condoleeza Rice & Colin Powell would give Bush cover for his racist policies. But it still smells, just like it did back in the day of the KKK, Nazis & Britian killing Catholics.

[stefan segal]

Butch set the rules out himself.."anyone who harbors or aids a terrorist is equally guilty"...and anyone who enables butch should be put up against the same wall as the butch crime family.

Lunch...I think your examples only show that there are shitheels in every large grouping of people...I also think your sorting out administrators by color, for whatever reason is the short road to perdition...people are just folks...some good some not so good.

Stefan

[Mr. Blue]

A thread like this makes me cringe a bit, because it doesn't exactly lend itself to a meaningful debate on a topic. If you think Bush is racist and has had racial driven policies, please start there and let the debate mature from that point.

So, what makes you think Bush is a racist? His stance on affirmative action? His reaction time to Katrina? etc, etc, etc.

[imgonnaeaturlunch]

Hopefully my post will help people see Bush for what he really is or confirm what they're already thinking. If no one follows you're advice what are you there for......window dressing, that's it. Bush always sided with Cheney/Rumsfeld, who froze Powell out. Name me 1 thing Rice has accomplished. Nancy Pelosi showed that she too can go all over the world showing off a great pair of legs. H Bush had 3-4 non-whites or females in his administation. Clinton had at least 15. W Bush has or has had about the same number. But in the Clinton administration they were there to make policy not pose for photo ops.

[stefan segal]

I don't think race is an issue with butch...I mentioned sorting people out by color for Lunch, not butch.

Butch is a rabid classist...if you don't share his level of power and wealth, aren't a member of the same killer clubs, then you are simply functional in psychopath butch's mind and ken...on a level with toilet paper, wnd worthy of just the same consideration as used toilet paper when you've served his purpose.

His famous "loyalty" trait is reserved for bonesmen and insiders who could sink him if they turned states evidence...his "loyalty" includes the option of killing his weak links...as a cheaper method of silence...but if that is not possible politically (he doesn't worry about the laws the rest of us live by and under), he make a great show of standing by (maybe behind) his man.

Stefan

[Mr. Blue]

Hopefully my post will help people see Bush for what he really is or confirm what they're already thinking.

Meaningful debate comes from well framed points. Calling Colin Powell an Uncle Tom is unfair. Saying he sold out his race is also unfair. Powell honorably served his country for his whole life and doesn't deserve getting slammed as a sell out to his race.

You're obviously race baiting, which is fine, it seems that it's a common thing to do nowadays. So I'm going ask you again, what specific policies do you think Bush has enacted that makes him a racist? He may very well be a racist, but I want you to elevate the conversation to something that can actually be discussed.

Personally I agree with Stefan, Bush isn't a racist, he's an elitist.

[imgonnaeaturlunch]

Meaningful debate comes from well framed points. Calling Colin Powell an Uncle Tom is unfair. Saying he sold out his race is also unfair. Powell honorably served his country for his whole life and doesn't deserve getting slammed as a sell out to his race.

You're obviously race baiting, which is fine, it seems that it's a common thing to do nowadays. So I'm going ask you again, what specific policies do you think Bush has enacted that makes him a racist? He may very well be a racist, but I want you to elevate the conversation to something that can actually be discussed.

Personally I agree with Stefan, Bush isn't a racist, he's an elitist.
I said Powell was frozen out of every decision that involved Cheney and/or Rumsfeld's input. I can't think of 1 significant thing Bush followed Powell's advice on. Now, there's a saying that goes:"if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it's a duck". I can't give specifics but I know what I see. Cheney having his own NSC staff, isn't that unusual? This obviously sends a message to Rice that Bush doesn't have confidence in her stewardship of the NSC. Why don't you name 1 thing Rice & Powell have given Bush advice on in which he in turn acted upon.

[Mr. Blue]

I said Powell was frozen out of every decision that involved Cheney and/or Rumsfeld's input. I can't think of 1 significant thing Bush followed Powell's advice on. Now, there's a saying that goes:"if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it's a duck". I can't give specifics but I know what I see. Cheney having his own NSC staff, isn't that unusual? This obviously sends a message to Rice that Bush doesn't have confidence in her stewardship of the NSC. Why don't you name 1 thing Rice & Powell have given Bush advice on in which he in turn acted upon.

You make a thread saying Bush is a racist and he used Rice/Powell to cover his racists policies. So I'm asking you for the third time in this thread...what is Bush's Racist Policies?

Let's not have a Kanye West style, "Bush Hates Black People" type arguments. Even I can come up with a few policies that might in our politically correct times be considered racist...so let's hear what you got on the topic.

Now if you can't name any racists policies then this thread you started is pretty much pointless.

[imgonnaeaturlunch]

You make a thread saying Bush is a racist and he used Rice/Powell to cover his racists policies. So I'm asking you for the third time in this thread...what is Bush's Racist Policies?

Let's not have a Kanye West style, "Bush Hates Black People" type arguments. Even I can come up with a few policies that might in our politically correct times be considered racist...so let's hear what you got on the topic.

Now if you can't name any racists policies then this thread you started is pretty much pointless.
OK,lets look at Katrina. The government has been terribly slow to help Louisiana but Mississippi is another story. Why? Because Mississippi is a solid red state with a GOP governor. New orleans on the other hand is solidly democratic in addition to having a large african-american population. So in this instance Bush is getting twice the bang for his buck. How about the miserable way Bush handled Katrina after it passed. All those people in the Superdome. It was criminal. The fact that Bush didnot take Powell's advice on any important issue doesn't tell you something. The fact that you can't come up with 1 thing that Bush DID follow Powell's advice on is enough right there.

[Mr. Blue]

You're saying that Katrina was race driven, lol, no it was incompetence on every level government. I like how you leave out Ray Nagin's role in what happened in New Orleans, but I suppose that would be politically incorrect to criticize his actions. I suppose him not using the municipal buses, vehicles, etc, to evacuate people never entered his mind because he realized no one would criticize him and that he would be blindly be re-elected.

If Katrina is the best you can come up with you have a pretty weak argument going for you saying Bush = KKK and he used two black people to cover it all up.

Why this thread annoys me is you're race baiting. I'm tired of people using the race card whenever they have a chance to because it diminishes the power for when real racism goes on that needs to be addressed seriously.

As for Powell and Bush. You have to realize just because Powell African American he doesn't necessarily have to follow your predefined stereotype of what a African-American should be. Powell is a Conservative, not a Democrat, and he's allied himself with the GOP. So...maybe you shouldn't stereotype people just on the color of their skin.

Onto Powell and Bush. You said and I quote:

So I guess it shouldn't be any surprise that Condoleeza Rice & Colin Powell would give Bush cover for his racist policies.

So...again...what racist polices? If you had said, George Bush used Colin Powell to sell an unjust war. I'd agree with you, Powell would agree with you, but instead you throw "racist policies" into the mix and can't back up your argument.

Bush is the biggest moron on the planet...I agree with that. However, I do respect Powell, and it's unfair to label him a sellout to his race just because he has a different political ideology.

[imgonnaeaturlunch]

You're saying that Katrina was race driven, lol, no it was incompetence on every level government. I like how you leave out Ray Nagin's role in what happened in New Orleans, but I suppose that would be politically incorrect to criticize his actions. I suppose him not using the municipal buses, vehicles, etc, to evacuate people never entered his mind because he realized no one would criticize him and that he would be blindly be re-elected.

If Katrina is the best you can come up with you have a pretty weak argument going for you saying Bush = KKK and he used two black people to cover it all up.

Why this thread annoys me is you're race baiting. I'm tired of people using the race card whenever they have a chance to because it diminishes the power for when real racism goes on that needs to be addressed seriously.

As for Powell and Bush. You have to realize just because Powell African American he doesn't necessarily have to follow your predefined stereotype of what a African-American should be. Powell is a Conservative, not a Democrat, and he's allied himself with the GOP. So...maybe you shouldn't stereotype people just on the color of their skin.

Onto Powell and Bush. You said and I quote:



So...again...what racist polices? If you had said, George Bush used Colin Powell to sell an unjust war. I'd agree with you, Powell would agree with you, but instead you throw "racist policies" into the mix and can't back up your argument.

Bush is the biggest moron on the planet...I agree with that. However, I do respect Powell, and it's unfair to label him a sellout to his race just because he has a different political ideology.
I readily admit african-americans are & vote GOP for a variety of reasons. Some because Lincoln "set slaves free" though he was willing to continue slavery to avoid war. A NBA, african-nonamerican player said that most NBA players vote GOP because they believe they pay less taxes( which was disturbing to hear given how much social programs,the few the democrats have been able to implement, have helped african-americans fight racism in addition to the misconception regarding taxes). So african-americans along with other non-whites & women all have their own reasons for voting GOP, I can live with that. The Iraq war is racist from the standpoint, if you look at the wars the GOP has fought since Vietnam they've all been against non-whites. The Bushes in particular apparrently love killing arabs. The thing you have in common with the GOP is that you like african-americans to be seen & not heard. Rice and Powell are getting paid but I hope they pay a price for it within the african-american community.

[Mr. Blue]

How weak of an argument is that...it's bordering on the ridiculous.

Iraq has shit nothing to do with race. It has everything to do with oil. If there wasn't oil in the middle east we'd be like, Iraq who? Iran what? I've said for along time that if we had alternate energy we wouldn't even be interested in building sandcastles over there.

Vietnam, umm, that was a rather stupid effort to contain communism. If you want to talk about white on white wars. WWI, WWII, War of 1812, Revolutionary war...it think the combined totals of whities killing whities out number the death toll of whities killing some other race.

You're desperately fixated on racism and you can't make your point because there's no point to be made. Rice / Powell are black Republicans...you can't stomach anyone being a republican, but a black republican gives you this ability to throw the race card.

Sorry if you truly want to understand the heart of racism it rests in using a stereotype to determine how an individual should act. That's all you've done in this thread. This has nothing to do with racists policies because you can't come up with one legitimate policy...this has everything to do with your own limited view of how a black person should act.

Try not to look at the color of the skin for a bit...it might be an eye opener. Try to form opinion based on fact and you'll find that you can paint the Bush administration for what it is, a bumbling clusterfuck that's put America in jeopardy.

It's arguments like, Bush = KKK, Powell is an Uncle Tom, etc, that loses elections. Elevate yourself beyond race baiting, as it's this type of argument, these types of statements, that alienate independents and moderates from the democratic party.

[Mr. Blue]

Also Bush is an elitist...elitists don't know how to discriminate, they screw over everyone.

[stefan segal]

Lunch...goddamn man...you are off the wall with this gop+blacks thing. Obama's father told him that a black voting for a repug is like a cockroach votiong for Raid...Obama laughed through this as he told it. If what you think is true, then why would Obama risk alienating the blacks who already don't think he's black enough?

Look on the wall next to jesus and you will see Kennedy (with a johnson chaser). The dems have done more for blacks than Lincoln, who fought to preserve the union...blacks were incidental except stategically by freeing them deep into the southland, he figured to spark a mau-mau level insurrection. You bought into the sizzle boy!

Blue...if you look at the bigger picture, you will see a pattern forming after doing away with Teddy Rosevelt's trust-busting, of wars by the calendar...it's an ecconomic thing similar to pruning.
The industrial-military complex makes a fortune, along with almost every other big business. Tell me how a humongous product like a warship or a tank can be re-ordered in the same year as it's delivery, without some accomodating enemy destroying it to create the vacuume to fill?

Think planes, trucks, bulldozers, boots, guns, ammo, food, on and on, this humongous market suddenly flowers....who wouldn't go to war?
Vietnam was miraculous in it's waste...of everything, including men.
Iraq, with it's oil is a throwback to earlier wars before our civil war...wars of acquisition. Hitler certainly was a war of acquisition from his point of view, but we fought for principle (and the industrial military complex...in fact we had so much money after the II WW, and liked the rate of flow enough to keep it going for a while, we instituted the Marshal plan to rebuild Europe on borrowed money from our yet to be born US new debtors. Big business got gravey, and like today, our children will get to wash the plates when we're done partying.
War is a stupid response to everything but a direct attack...we are so fond of war as a nation because it's good for business.

Stefan

[Mr. Blue]

stefan, you raised some good points.

The thing that I see happening is a magicians act. For a magician to pull off slight of hand type stuff, there's always that moment of distraction, always that moment of making you look at the wrong spot as the deception goes on.

At this moment, race and the race card is becoming one of those distractions while the deception is going on...the race card gets thrown and you miss the trick.

Look at the last election, what was the magicians trick? Gay marriage. That's right, America is going to hell in a hand basket and what was one of the deciding factors in a Bush win...gay marriage. When you think of how ludicrous it is...all of Bush's errors got swept behind the issue of gay marriage. :disbelief:

Also Kerry and his swift boat crap...Kerry couldn't put out the slight of hand distraction...that became an issue instead of Bush being a fuck up.

Finally, I see it happening with Obama. He's getting flack for not being black enough. He's getting flack for being too black. FUCK. I swear to god, let's look at the man and not the color of his skin.

Racism is horrible, but the boy who cried wolf is starting to weaken the impact of it. The Duke Rape case...classic example. Cynthia McKinney claiming racism when she hits a guard, etc, etc, etc.

We're missing the big problems, the big deceptions, because we're letting the magic show go on.

[imgonnaeaturlunch]

stefan, you raised some good points.

The thing that I see happening is a magicians act. For a magician to pull off slight of hand type stuff, there's always that moment of distraction, always that moment of making you look at the wrong spot as the deception goes on.

At this moment, race and the race card is becoming one of those distractions while the deception is going on...the race card gets thrown and you miss the trick.

Look at the last election, what was the magicians trick? Gay marriage. That's right, America is going to hell in a hand basket and what was one of the deciding factors in a Bush win...gay marriage. When you think of how ludicrous it is...all of Bush's errors got swept behind the issue of gay marriage. :disbelief:

Also Kerry and his swift boat crap...Kerry couldn't put out the slight of hand distraction...that became an issue instead of Bush being a fuck up.

Finally, I see it happening with Obama. He's getting flack for not being black enough. He's getting flack for being too black. FUCK. I swear to god, let's look at the man and not the color of his skin.

Racism is horrible, but the boy who cried wolf is starting to weaken the impact of it. The Duke Rape case...classic example. Cynthia McKinney claiming racism when she hits a guard, etc, etc, etc.

We're missing the big problems, the big deceptions, because we're letting the magic show go on.
I've made some great points in my opinion, you have not, in my opinion. How can a party that is overwhelming white & proudly promotes itself as so know anything about people from other walks of life. They can't. Which is why it is laughable to think that the GOP is going to bring Sunni & Shiite together in Iraq. What's the GOP stategy in Iraq? To build walls to seperate the 2 which is thier solution to everything. You don't want to admit there are differances between people based on their life experiences instead you want everyone to be like you, that's GOP speak. Just like in the way they dress: dark suit, red tie, white shirt. They want to eliminate the differences in the U S by having everyone dress & act like them. That's the GOP solution to diversity. As far as Rice & Powell are concerned, any psychologist, sociologist or psychiatrist worth a darn will tell that a minority is always tempted to behave like the majority because , in most all cases, most people prefer to be in the majority.

[Mr. Blue]

You drop the race card way too much. You're a one trick pony. You've said Bush used Powell and Rice to back up racist policies yet you can't name one specific example of those racist policies.

The motivation for the Iraq war was racism? No...the motivation was oil. Katrina? Considering the Black Mayor fucked up royally during it as well I'd chalk this one up to extreme incompetence.

So again, how did Bush specifically use Powell and Rice to cover up racist policies? I'm asking you to name the specific racist policies. If you had said, "Bush used Powell to cover an illegal war" no one would disagree with you.

Also your last post illustrates your general opinion that blacks have to be a certain way for you to accept them. I don't use a cookie cutter mentality like you do. People don't have to act a certain way just because the color of their skin. Isn't the ultimate goal to judge people by their actions and not their skin color?

If you come up with a specific example of how Bush used Rice/Powell to cover up a racist policy I'd be glad to read it.

[imgonnaeaturlunch]

You drop the race card way too much. You're a one trick pony. You've said Bush used Powell and Rice to back up racist policies yet you can't name one specific example of those racist policies.

The motivation for the Iraq war was racism? No...the motivation was oil. Katrina? Considering the Black Mayor fucked up royally during it as well I'd chalk this one up to extreme incompetence.

So again, how did Bush specifically use Powell and Rice to cover up racist policies? I'm asking you to name the specific racist policies. If you had said, "Bush used Powell to cover an illegal war" no one would disagree with you.

Also your last post illustrates your general opinion that blacks have to be a certain way for you to accept them. I don't use a cookie cutter mentality like you do. People don't have to act a certain way just because the color of their skin. Isn't the ultimate goal to judge people by their actions and not their skin color?

If you come up with a specific example of how Bush used Rice/Powell to cover up a racist policy I'd be glad to read it.
Perhaps the best example of Bush's racist policies is the lack of policy designed to help those who've been victoms of racism. That's the cover Rice & Powell have given Bush. For example: H Bush had 3-4 non-whites/females in his administration, Clinton had at least 15. Now, was H Bush a racist because he made less of an effort than Clinton to bring in non-whites & females into his administration? Some would say yes. W Bush has had about the same number as Clinton but does that mean he's trying to make his administration more diverse? Not if Rice & Powell are examples of how the Bush administration values the opinions of the non-whites & females in his administration. As far as Katrina is concerned, I'm sure there are african-americans who wanted to see a certain part of New Orleans " washed" away as well, the mayor being 1 of them. So what. That doesn't make it right. The best example of Bush's indifference toward non-whites & females is his lack of policy in those areas.

[Mr. Blue]

So since you can't find a policy issue you're now switching it to say that the lack of policy issues that makes him a racist. Gotcha.

As for diversity in his cabinet. Bush has done better than most Presidents, probably the only one with a more diverse cabinet is Clinton. Bush, however, is a conservative first and foremost and of course he's going to pick cabinet members that share in his conservative outlook.

What you can't handle is the fact that a black person can be a Republican and a Conservative...which more or less makes you a racist. Sorry, not every person can live up to your predetermined stereotypes and you should learn to accept that fact.

[imgonnaeaturlunch]

So since you can't find a policy issue you're now switching it to say that the lack of policy issues that makes him a racist. Gotcha.

As for diversity in his cabinet. Bush has done better than most Presidents, probably the only one with a more diverse cabinet is Clinton. Bush, however, is a conservative first and foremost and of course he's going to pick cabinet members that share in his conservative outlook.

What you can't handle is the fact that a black person can be a Republican and a Conservative...which more or less makes you a racist. Sorry, not every person can live up to your predetermined stereotypes and you should learn to accept that fact.
You're going over the same old ground, saying the same thing which means " I GOT YOU"!!!!!!!!!!! Thank You Very Much. At least you were willing to admit Clinton's cabinet was more diverse unlike alot of the GOP. I've already given plenty of reasons of why some african-americans vote conservative. The fact that I have a problem with it is no different than the reasons I have a problem with ANYONE who votes conservative.

[Mr. Blue]

Unfortunately I had to go over old ground because you couldn't back up your original statement and still haven't.

Considering the theme of your last few posts I would have to say you've got an unhealthy obsession with race and you're trying to find racism in everything. Psst, want to go over the whites can't dance thread again? LOL

[imgonnaeaturlunch]

Unfortunately I had to go over old ground because you couldn't back up your original statement and still haven't.

Considering the theme of your last few posts I would have to say you've got an unhealthy obsession with race and you're trying to find racism in everything. Psst, want to go over the whites can't dance thread again? LOL
I can say this unequivocally. No GOP president since FDR has done much to improve the lot of those who weren't brought into this world with some kind of priveledge which gives them a leg up in the U S. If anything, the GOP continues to try to do away with programs which do aid those very people by trying to label it socialism while they in fact do the very same thing only they label their efforts " defense industry, military programs, defense missle system" & on & on.

[Betty Blowtorch]

http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/601/colinpowellymcamedjw0.jpg
Are you in the mood


http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/5539/oreosf9.jpg
for an OREO?

http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/8537/thomascspankv8.jpg

[imgonnaeaturlunch]

Unfortunately I had to go over old ground because you couldn't back up your original statement and still haven't.

Considering the theme of your last few posts I would have to say you've got an unhealthy obsession with race and you're trying to find racism in everything. Psst, want to go over the whites can't dance thread again? LOL
What is a " healthy" obsession of race in your opinion. Yes, seeing Bush & Rove embarass themselves was comical but it also showed me how far they would go to try to " win" people over to their side & to know they were simply trying to manipulate & were not sincere whatsoever is what disgusts me the most.

[imgonnaeaturlunch]

Here's a great example of what the GOP is all about. Under Clinton, congress gave money to keep gyms open until 12am to give primarily young african-american kids some place to go & something to do. The GOP & their allies( right wing talk radio & others like FOX) had a fit. They made fun of the fact that these kids were being helped by this. Well what really bothered these creeps is that : 1) they were being reminded that african-americans are excelling at basketball at a much greater number than whites & 2) they just don't like anything that improves the lives of african-americans but I personally beleive it was the #1 that caused them the most discomfort. As a result this was ended. Now, imagine a lower income neghiborhood of young whites who were getting into trouble. So they decide to keep the baseball diamonds open until 12am & it helped with the crime problem, what do you think the response would be? Hell, they'd all be trying to get on camera to take credie for the success. The mere plethora of right-wing radio in this country should tell you how far this country still has to go when it comes to race relations because that's what right wing radio primarily is, race bashing.

[imgonnaeaturlunch]

http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/601/colinpowellymcamedjw0.jpg
Are you in the mood


http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/5539/oreosf9.jpg
for an OREO?

http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/8537/thomascspankv8.jpg
I don't beleive in labeling someone an " oreo". That's a very subjective accusation with no defnitive meaning.

[Betty Blowtorch]

I don't beleive in labeling someone an " oreo".
That's a very subjective accusation with no
defnitive meaning.
I believe in good spelling. http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/9959/drunkirish048am8.gif

[Betty Blowtorch]

On a more serious note http://img81.imageshack.us/img81/2303/simpsonsbuttfh7.gif


I don't know if OREO has a definitive meaning http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/2912/magnifyingglassresizesmlr2.jpg
but it definitely has a meaning. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncle_Tom)