I wonder who's going to pay the $250,000...

[Bill]

... Because it sure ain't gonna be the boys family.

And I wonder where the hell you can find a dentist that will pull a tooth for only $80? Hell, I'd gay-marry any dentist that was that cheap around here.

----

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/02/27/AR2007022702116.html

Twelve-year-old Deamonte Driver died of a toothache Sunday.

A routine, $80 tooth extraction might have saved him.

If his mother had been insured.

If his family had not lost its Medicaid.

If Medicaid dentists weren't so hard to find.

If his mother hadn't been focused on getting a dentist for his brother, who had six rotted teeth.

By the time Deamonte's own aching tooth got any attention, the bacteria from the abscess had spread to his brain, doctors said. After two operations and more than six weeks of hospital care, the Prince George's County boy died.

Deamonte's death and the ultimate cost of his care, which could total more than $250,000, underscore an often-overlooked concern in the debate over universal health coverage: dental care.

[Caskey_91]

... Because it sure ain't gonna be the boys family.

And I wonder where the hell you can find a dentist that will pull a tooth for only $80? Hell, I'd gay-marry any dentist that was that cheap around here.

----

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/02/27/AR2007022702116.html

Twelve-year-old Deamonte Driver died of a toothache Sunday.

A routine, $80 tooth extraction might have saved him.

If his mother had been insured.

If his family had not lost its Medicaid.

If Medicaid dentists weren't so hard to find.

If his mother hadn't been focused on getting a dentist for his brother, who had six rotted teeth.

By the time Deamonte's own aching tooth got any attention, the bacteria from the abscess had spread to his brain, doctors said. After two operations and more than six weeks of hospital care, the Prince George's County boy died.

Deamonte's death and the ultimate cost of his care, which could total more than $250,000, underscore an often-overlooked concern in the debate over universal health coverage: dental care.

how'd they lose their medicade. Because I smell a big lawsuit knocking on Medicade's door here soon.

[Bill]

I remember several times when I had toothache problems and I either couldn't afford a dentist, or I was having real problems finding a dentist, and I was worried about the risks of an infection really causing me harm.

It's sad to hear of a kid dieing from it - but that's the extreme case, usually one doesn't die, one just suffers.

I discovered a weird herbal remedy that saved me a couple of times - chewing plaintain leaf and holding it against the gum, it would somehow draw the infection to the surface and give relief. Kinda nasty, in several ways, but it did work.

When I first started running my own construction companies I of course couldn't afford health insurance, and naturally most health insurance didn't cover dental either way, so not treating a toothache was just what one had to endure.

The first tootache I ever had, I had good health insurance, but no dental - it was going to cost about $450 to get a root canal and save that front tooth, and when I went to the dentist and didn't have all the money to pay upfront they turned me away, and wouldn't even give me painkillers or antibiotics.

That was tough to deal with.

[exarmyranger]

[QUOTE=Bill]I remember several times when I had toothache problems and I either couldn't afford a dentist, or I was having real problems finding a dentist, and I was worried about the risks of an infection really causing me harm.

It's sad to hear of a kid dieing from it - but that's the extreme case, usually one doesn't die, one just suffers.

I discovered a weird herbal remedy that saved me a couple of times - chewing plaintain leaf and holding it against the gum, it would somehow draw the infection to the surface and give relief. Kinda nasty, in several ways, but it did work.Clove works ok,but it tastes like...err kinda nasty to.

When I first started running my own construction companies I of course couldn't afford health insurance, and naturally most health insurance didn't cover dental either way, so not treating a toothache was just what one had to endure.:oldman:I've yanked a dozen at least,the first buddy I relieved from pain,was a grand success."Aww man this tooth is killing me."I'd pull it myself but...I do'nt know if I can.Tell ya what Briscoe get me a pair of needlenose pliers and I'll do it...Just so you stop whining."Cool i'll be right back"...ok sit here,open yer jaws,and put the pliers on the bad one,(botton front center)they all look the same.Got it? OKAY on 3...1,YANK tada clean as a whistle root an all."SHIT" that was'nt it. :saywhat: it's the one next to it in the middle,ok then 1,2,3,"come-on Bo that ain't funny,I...YANK and another successfull exstraction.Yo'Briscoe this one looks like..Shit!that was'nt it either:lmao2: so as it's said three times is a charm,It has to be this one...Ok yank.Ureeka...:thumbsup: ex

[kres24GT]

This article is disgusting. The woman who wrote it should be fired. Here is a mother who killed her child and she is made out to be a sympathetic person. Absolutely vile. I hope both the mother and the author get what is coming to them. No mention whatsoever of the mother's neglect. What a joke.

[Bill]

She should have had her pimp punch that tooth out of the boys mouth, right, Kres.

[kres24GT]

She should have had her pimp punch that tooth out of the boys mouth, right, Kres.

?????????????????????????????????????????



The child is dead 100% due to his mother's failure as a parent.

1. Anyone who can't afford 80 bucks to save their kids life, shouldn't have kids.
2. I guarantee this woman could have come up with 80 bucks if she had made half an effort.
3. She decided it was too much work to take advantage of tax payer healthcare as well. God forbid an effort be made to find a doctor who will provide your son with life saving healthcare at someone else's expense.


The woman should be in jail for murder.


You disagree this child is dead due to his mother's gross incompetence as a mother and a human being. Do tell, who is at fault?

[exarmyranger]

?????????????????????????????????????????



The child is dead 100%! (Yo kres,is there any other kind of dead than 100% dead)like umm,Dead Lite 50% less dead,than other corpse's,due to his mother's failure as a parent.:lmao2: sorry,sometimes I crack me up...:D

1. Anyone who can't afford 80 bucks to save their kids life, shouldn't have kids.
2. I guarantee this woman could have come up with 80 bucks if she had made half an effort.
3. She decided it was too much work to take advantage of tax payer healthcare as well. God forbid an effort be made to find a doctor who will provide your son with life saving healthcare at someone else's expense.


The woman should be in jail for murder.*Hmm,I copy that kres.What degree? 1st,2nd,3rd(manslaughter,5 to 10),unlawfull negligence(resulting in death),involentary manslaughter,or Lets make a Deal,civil suit for wrongfull death.Not likely since she apparently has nada.


You disagree this child is dead due to his mother's gross incompetence as a mother and a human being. Do tell, who is at fault?Hell kres,how in the fck would I know,do tell...It seems rather obvious the women,is'nt the sharpest tool in the shed,the degree of her dullness,should be asertained by professionals prior to any formal charge(s),she may just be stuck on stupid,& fit for trial,conviction,& sentencing...But she may not have enough bricks for a full load,and found to be wanting,in the knowing right from wrong section.Making her unfit to stand trial,due to her inability to understand what the freaking problem is...:dunno: Is there a State Institution for the Criminally
Stupid Bitches,where she could recieve treatment for however long it takes,to add a enough bricks to her load.Enabling her to stand trial...ex

[Caskey_91]

?????????????????????????????????????????



The child is dead 100% due to his mother's failure as a parent.

1. Anyone who can't afford 80 bucks to save their kids life, shouldn't have kids.
2. I guarantee this woman could have come up with 80 bucks if she had made half an effort.
3. She decided it was too much work to take advantage of tax payer healthcare as well. God forbid an effort be made to find a doctor who will provide your son with life saving healthcare at someone else's expense.


The woman should be in jail for murder.


You disagree this child is dead due to his mother's gross incompetence as a mother and a human being. Do tell, who is at fault?

Okay here i'll play Devils Advocate and support the woman for just a few minutes.

1. She's prolly on welfare or someother goverment program which gives you JUST enoungh to squeak by. JUST enough. To the point where you really have no spare cash.

2. She had 2 sons with teeth problems and here others was seemingly worse off so she put her efforts into that son's problem.

3. Here medicade got cancelled I don't know how it can be, but it obviously was.

I do agree however that the mother is still partially if not at least 1/2 at fault here.

[kres24GT]

Okay here i'll play Devils Advocate and support the woman for just a few minutes.

1. She's prolly on welfare or someother goverment program which gives you JUST enoungh to squeak by. JUST enough. To the point where you really have no spare cash.

2. She had 2 sons with teeth problems and here others was seemingly worse off so she put her efforts into that son's problem.

3. Here medicade got cancelled I don't know how it can be, but it obviously was.

I do agree however that the mother is still partially if not at least 1/2 at fault here.



Who is th other 1/2 at fault?

If I buy a boat I can't afford to keep up and the boat sinks due to unkept maitinence, it's only half my fault?????

Just enough to get by? You are telling me this woman hasn't spent 80 bucks in luxuries in the past year? Yeah right.

[Bill]

It certainly wouldn't surprize me if she ends up in jail.

Prisons are a growth industry.

[Caskey_91]

Who is th other 1/2 at fault?

If I buy a boat I can't afford to keep up and the boat sinks due to unkept maitinence, it's only half my fault?????

Just enough to get by? You are telling me this woman hasn't spent 80 bucks in luxuries in the past year? Yeah right.

Okay the whole boat example was prolly one of the worst you could use. If her medicade was taken away then it should have partial blame on the medicade, depending if their reason on taking it away is just or not.

Also I've looked around and it's cost's on Average a hell of alot more than $80 bucks to pull a tooth. She also hadd a second son who's situation was looking worse off than the one that had died, so obviously she had all of her "LUXURY" money on helping him.

This all could've been avoided by brushing :)

[kres24GT]

Okay the whole boat example was prolly one of the worst you could use. If her medicade was taken away then it should have partial blame on the medicade, depending if their reason on taking it away is just or not.

Also I've looked around and it's cost's on Average a hell of alot more than $80 bucks to pull a tooth. She also hadd a second son who's situation was looking worse off than the one that had died, so obviously she had all of her "LUXURY" money on helping him.

This all could've been avoided by brushing :)


Ahh, to be this naive.

[exarmyranger]

[QUOTE=Caskey_91]Okay the whole boat example was prolly one of the worst you could use. If her medicade was taken away then it should have partial blame on the medicade, depending if their reason on taking it away is just or not.

Also I've looked around and it's cost's on Average a hell of alot more than $80 bucks to pull a tooth. She also hadd a second son who's situation was looking worse off than the one that had died, so obviously she had all of her "LUXURY" money on helping him.

This all could've been avoided by brushing:thumbsup: Absoulutly,,,"Remember Kid's" Brush after every meal,you'll be:D glad you did!
:oldman: "That's Right",and do'nt forgit to floss regular neither,little Buck-a-roo's...Those choppers gotta last a liftime...Ya Hear!:cool: ex

[Bill]

I still think the compelling question is, "Who's going to pay the $250,000?".

I think that much of what is wrong with our health care system today is tied up in questions like this.

We have great health care, but the way it's delivered is deeply flawed. For want of $80 (yeah right, a dentist that will pull a tooth for $80 - that figure just pisses me off...), now someone has to pay a quarter million.

For want of good basic health care, we have to pay many, many, many times as much for extreme health care. (The emergency room is the poor persons doctor, but costs 20-50 times as much.)

For want of a just health care system, people without insurance are charged 3 to 10 times as much as people with health insurance, for the same care.

I'll leave it to Kres to argue against the deficiencies of a mother - that's not the issue I think is underscored by this event.

The issue I think affects us all is - $80 (really $300) versus $250,000.

[kres24GT]

I still think the compelling question is, "Who's going to pay the $250,000?".

I think that much of what is wrong with our health care system today is tied up in questions like this.

We have great health care, but the way it's delivered is deeply flawed. For want of $80 (yeah right, a dentist that will pull a tooth for $80 - that figure just pisses me off...), now someone has to pay a quarter million.

For want of good basic health care, we have to pay many, many, many times as much for extreme health care. (The emergency room is the poor persons doctor, but costs 20-50 times as much.)

For want of a just health care system, people without insurance are charged 3 to 10 times as much as people with health insurance, for the same care.

I'll leave it to Kres to argue against the deficiencies of a mother - that's not the issue I think is underscored by this event.

The issue I think affects us all is - $80 (really $300) versus $250,000.



Because the government forces people to help other in these cases, the cost will be passed on to other consumers in the health care market who are actually responsible and pay for their own care. Stop forcing doctors to help people who can't afford their services. Let them be free to do or not. This idea that government should force people to help others is beyond ridiculous.

[exarmyranger]

The cost for a simple single tooth extraction,including X-Ray,and a prescription for a doz.vicodine/or other analgesic med.$137.00,or(what a deal)a 2nd extraction (same visit) for $187.00,addisional extraction $75.00 per...:hammer:of course thier is a small catch if you feel you need to ask your attending D.D.S.any questions,it helps to be Bi-Linguistic,Spanish,or even better than that Pakastani/India dialects.:D ...If a general (state funded)hospital emergency room...staff member refused the boys addmission before a resident emr doctor/nurse,made any pre addmission for treatment examination(s)...That somebody owe's,or should...but then who am I to say?t/c ex

[Bill]

This idea that government should force people to help others is beyond ridiculous.

But government should force mothers not to take their dying children to emergency rooms? Or maybe hospitals should surround the emergency rooms with private security forces with pepperspray and shockrods to beat the mothers without insurance away from the doors, and charge their richer customers insurance companies for the service? At a nice profit, naturally.

Your "policy" condems us to spend $250,000 when we should have spent $80.

Government's whole purpose is to force people to do things they wouldn't otherwise do. It has been since the first governments were created 12,000 years ago.

I'm not married to the idea that government can generate a solution. But private industry sure as hell isn't even trying to do anything about this but make more money off it - and much of that money already comes from government, thru things like the recent prescription legislation, medicaid, and especially medicare.

[Bill]

I've heard there are cheaper dentists in some of the older towns about 40 miles away from where I live, Ex.

I've not heard of dentists that cheap around here - maybe at the university if you're a student.

[kres24GT]

But government should force mothers not to take their dying children to emergency rooms? Or maybe hospitals should surround the emergency rooms with private security forces with pepperspray and shockrods to beat the mothers without insurance away from the doors, and charge their richer customers insurance companies for the service? At a nice profit, naturally.

Your "policy" condems us to spend $250,000 when we should have spent $80.

Government's whole purpose is to force people to do things they wouldn't otherwise do. It has been since the first governments were created 12,000 years ago.

I'm not married to the idea that government can generate a solution. But private industry sure as hell isn't even trying to do anything about this but make more money off it - and much of that money already comes from government, thru things like the recent prescription legislation, medicaid, and especially medicare.


My policy gives us the freedom to choose. It gives the providers the freedom to choose whether or not they provide the service, whether or nto they prvide at their cost, or their customers cost, and gives the customers the ability to do/not do business with providers who give care to others at their expense.

You keep pimping the positives of your system like I don't get them. I do, but I don't care. You want government to provide preventive care to people under the premise that it will save us money by preventing emergency care down the road. Even if I bought your premise (while sound, it's still government), I don't care. If government is going to interfere in our choices for our best interest, then prevent these people from having kids, that is even cheaper.

[exarmyranger]

FREEDOM of choice...was one thing in the beggining years of this Nation,it's another thing now.The "choices" where one,lives,works,worships,and what/how one does.Are not,(in numbers,or diversitys),comparable to the choices today.Can you name,any nation,country,or people,in world history.Be they the conquerd,or the conquerers,empires,kingdoms,clans,tribes,ect.That have survived intact.Change is enevitable,it can be slowed/detoured,ignored,denied,but not stopped...ex

[kres24GT]

FREEDOM of choice...was one thing in the beggining years of this Nation,it's another thing now.The "choices" where one,lives,works,worships,and what/how one does.Are not,(in numbers,or diversitys),comparable to the choices today.Can you name,any nation,country,or people,in world history.Be they the conquerd,or the conquerers,empires,kingdoms,clans,tribes,ect.That have survived intact.Change is enevitable,it can be slowed/detoured,ignored,denied,but not stopped...ex


Like I said, if the government is going to take away our choices, then take away the choice of people to have children who shouldn't.

[Caskey_91]

Like I said, if the government is going to take away our choices, then take away the choice of people to have children who shouldn't.

So we should run a dictatorship is what your pretty much saying.

[kres24GT]

So we should run a dictatorship is what your pretty much saying.

What are you talking about?