Fighting Iran in Iraq

[Smurf-Herder]

Iran joined militias in battle for Basra
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article3690010.ece

"IRANIAN forces were involved in the recent battle for Basra, General David Petraeus, the US commander in Iraq, is expected to tell Congress this week.

Military and intelligence sources believe Iranians were operating at a tactical command level with the Shi’ite militias fighting Iraqi security forces; some were directing operations on the ground, they think."

Britons seized in Iraq may now be held in Iran
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article3690019.ece

"FIVE British hostages who were kidnapped in Iraq last year may be being held in Tehran, the Iranian capital, according to intelligence reports received by the Foreign Office.

The disclosure, supported by two security sources in London and officials in Iraq, means that any rescue attempt by British special forces would be almost impossible.

The latest intelligence follows statements last year by General David Petraeus, commander of US forces in Iraq, that he believed the five men had been abducted by a group funded, trained and armed by Iran."

"The hostages’ future is said to hinge on the release of Qais al-Khazaali, a former chief spokesman for the Mahdi Army, and eight other Mahdi officials.

Khazaali, who led a Mahdi faction trained in Iran, was detained by American forces after masterminding a raid inside a base in which five US soldiers were killed."

[Bill]

Not all the brits seem to be getting with the program.

maybe bush can send condi to the UK to hush the debate.

America needs this attack.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2008/04/05/wiran105.xml

British fear US commander is beating the drum for Iran strikes

The outbreak of Iraq's worst violence in 18 months last week with fighting in Basra and the daily bombardment of the Green Zone diplomatic enclave, demonstrated that although the Sunni Muslim insurgency is dramatically diminished, Shia forces remain in a strong position to destabilise the country.

"Petraeus is going to go very hard on Iran as the source of attacks on the American effort in Iraq," a British official said. "Iran is waging a war in Iraq. The idea that America can't fight a war on two fronts is wrong, there can be airstrikes and other moves," he said.

"Petraeus has put emphasis on America having to fight the battle on behalf of Iraq. In his report he can frame it in terms of our soldiers killed and diplomats dead in attacks on the Green Zone."

Tension between Washington and Tehran is already high over Iran's covert nuclear programme. The Bush administration has not ruled out military strikes.

In remarks interpreted as signalling a change in his approach to Iran, Gen Petraeus last week hit out at the Iranian leadership. "The rockets that were launched at the Green Zone were Iranian-provided, Iranian-made rockets," he said. "All of this in complete violation of promises made by President Ahmadinejad and the other most senior Iranian leaders to their Iraqi counterparts."

The humiliation of the Iraqi prime minister Nouri al-Maliki by the Iranian-backed cleric Moqtada al-Sadr in fighting in Basra last week triggered top-level warnings over Iran's strength in Iraq.

[Smurf-Herder]

US mil: Iraqi troops find largest EFP cache ever reported south of Baghdad
The Associated Press - April 6, 2008
http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/04/06/africa/ME-GEN-Iraq-Weapons-Cache.php

"BAGHDAD: The U.S. military says the largest cache of armor-piercing roadside bombs known as explosively formed penetrators has been found south of Baghdad.

A statement says Iraqi troops acting on a tip Wednesday found more than 1,000 bomb components in a 6-ton truck in a garage in the town of Qassim. American commanders allege that the EFPs come from Iran. Tehran denies the allegations.

The military says the cache included more than 3,000 pounds (1,360 kilograms) of explosives, multiple 107 mm rockets and stands along with other munitions."

IP detains 2 launching Iranian-made rockets (Baghdad)
Multi-National Corps – Iraq (Saturday, 05 April 2008)
http://www.mnf-iraq.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=18157&Itemid=128

"BAGHDAD – Iraqi Police detained two criminals preparing three Iranian-made rockets for an attack south of Baghdad April 2.

The apprehension came following tips from an Iraqi citizen and the local Abna al-Iraq, or Sons of Iraq. The rockets have been secured and turned over to Coalition forces.

Iraqi citizens and Sons of Iraq have been working with the IP to assist in enforcing the rule of law and disrupting criminal activity."

[disrupter]

Fighting the bogeyman in your nightmares, Smurf?

Please wake up.

Why can't you face the fact that your OWN incompetence is your WORST enemy & quit trying to project it on others?

Because you have the mind of a lilliputian.

[Smurf-Herder]

Fighting the bogeyman in your nightmares, Smurf?

Please wake up.

Why can't you face the fact that your OWN incompetence is your WORST enemy & quit trying to project it on others?

Because you have the mind of a lilliputian.

Take your medication!

[Bill]

Looks good. An attack can't be far off now.

What am I saying - lame duck Bush doesn't have the pull to make it happen.

That's a sad thought.

[Smurf-Herder]

Looks good. An attack can't be far off now.

What am I saying - lame duck Bush doesn't have the pull to make it happen.

That's a sad thought.

It's not so simple.

You're talking about a regional conflict that would dwarf the Iraq conflict, possibly involving missiles hitting Europe. Everybody involved has to be on the same page - and the other side really has to make an overt act worthy of retaliation. That's why I say watch Lebanon.

[Bill]

Yeah, I know what I'm talking about. I personally don't want to see the Great Middle Eastern War, but you guys seem determined, and my opinion doesn't matter.

---

I don't see lebanon as being a real trigger. Except for the coastline, Lebanon doesn't have anything that anyone else in the middle east cares about. Syria will get lebonan back into greater syria sooner or later, and syria is the only country with a real interest.

If Israel attacks lebanon, the other countries will just sit back and let israel break it's teeth on the shia hezbos. Sure, Iran and Syria will funnel weapons to the lebanese fighters, and dare israel to attack.

But, a real war on three fronts is a totally different proposition from sneak air attacks.

The Great Mideast War will be fought over oil, and israel, lebanon, and syria don't have enough of it to fight over.

Sure, israel might attack, to try to make up for losing in 2006, but, it just won't be important, just like it wasn't important in 2006.

[Smurf-Herder]

Yeah, I know what I'm talking about. I personally don't want to see the Great Middle Eastern War, but you guys seem determined, and my opinion doesn't matter.

---

I don't see lebanon as being a real trigger. Except for the coastline, Lebanon doesn't have anything that anyone else in the middle east cares about. Syria will get lebonan back into greater syria sooner or later, and syria is the only country with a real interest.

If Israel attacks lebanon, the other countries will just sit back and let israel break it's teeth on the shia hezbos. Sure, Iran and Syria will funnel weapons to the lebanese fighters, and dare israel to attack.

But, a real war on three fronts is a totally different proposition from sneak air attacks.

The Great Mideast War will be fought over oil, and israel, lebanon, and syria don't have enough of it to fight over.

Sure, israel might attack, to try to make up for losing in 2006, but, it just won't be important, just like it wasn't important in 2006.

I really don't think you have a good grasp of the situation.

The entire thing is planned to be a multi-front war by Iran, Syria and Hezbollah. Once any of then get attacked, they're all in it. Israel has already said they would strike Syria in retaliation of a massive Hezbollah strike. And Hezbollah has already said they'd join in if Iran was attacked - I'm sure the same goes for the Madhi Army in Iraq. And Iran has a defense pact with Syria, if Syria gets attacked. And Saudi Arabia, Jordan and Egypt will not stand for Lebanon being re-occupied by Syria. And Hamas and Hezbollah support each other. You can't just go after one, without everybody with a stake in this getting involved - ezpecially if they're firing missiles throughout the region.

Both sides have made an issue of any future Israeli-Hezbollah war not being just a 2006 redux; but a final, decisive war.

[Moby]

Looks good. An attack can't be far off now.

What am I saying - lame duck Bush doesn't have the pull to make it happen.

That's a sad thought.
Bush never had any pull since his father left office. He's only a mouthpiece for The PNAC and since they started putting the war together in 1998, I think they still have enough pull to do it if they wanted too.

I think they need to wait. Bush will try to start some shit in December, 2008, just like his daddy did but I don't see full scale war. That would really hurt the cause. I think the PNAC would love to do it with McCain and Romney in The White House. They'd make them both scape goats.

They'll work hard to cause some shit if it's a dem in office too.

I think they're going to wait.

[Bill]

(This is in response to SH's last post - I forgot the dang quote - okay, here it is -

SH> The entire thing is planned to be a multi-front war by Iran, Syria and Hezbollah.)

Nonsense. Each of those countries, and the hezbo faction which is an independent player, has profoundly conflicting interests.

There's no unity among them at all.

And even if there were, what the fuck are we supposed to do about it?

However, I stand behind my first statement, there's no unity, expect perhaps a shared hatred of israel.

But EVERYBODY hates israel - so that appearance of a unifying interest is not causitive. It's coincidental.

---

Anyway, my second argument still applies - what the fuck are we supposed to do about it?

I've already cheered you on to attack iran, even tho I believe it's profoundly against long term american interests, will lead to the Great Middle Eastern War, and the destruction of the US as a military player. What more could you possibly want?

You want me to cheer you on for attacking syria? Go ahead, you have my blessing, attack anybody you like. Not like my blessing means a fart in a hurricane.

[Bill]

I think they're going to wait.

If they wait, then it will clearly be a political game to screw the country, blessed by the republican leadership.

I can live with that. That also will damage the republicans and the red rank and file.

No matter what, the situation is profoundly fucked up, so, the dems are going to have a nightmare to unravel and repair. Attacking Iran won't make it substantially worse - it will only increase the weight of blame,

Personally, I think you are giving bush the lesser too much credit - I think he's not that sneaky.

I think he'll either do it this summer, in the hope that it will polarize the depressed republicans and get them to donate again. In hopes of keeping power, and specifically in hopes of avoiding the investigations of malfeasence and incompetence that are sure to come in the next few years, by keeping a nominally republican executive.

Or he'll do nothing.

[Smurf-Herder]

(This is in response to SH's last post - I forgot the dang quote - okay, here it is -

SH> The entire thing is planned to be a multi-front war by Iran, Syria and Hezbollah.)

Nonsense. Each of those countries, and the hezbo faction which is an independent player, has profoundly conflicting interests.

There's no unity among them at all.

And even if there were, what the fuck are we supposed to do about it?

However, I stand behind my first statement, there's no unity, expect perhaps a shared hatred of israel.

But EVERYBODY hates israel - so that appearance of a unifying interest is not causitive. It's coincidental.

---

Anyway, my second argument still applies - what the fuck are we supposed to do about it?

I've already cheered you on to attack iran, even tho I believe it's profoundly against long term american interests, will lead to the Great Middle Eastern War, and the destruction of the US as a military player. What more could you possibly want?

You want me to cheer you on for attacking syria? Go ahead, you have my blessing, attack anybody you like. Not like my blessing means a fart in a hurricane.

It dosn't mean a thing to me, because you seem so uninformed.

They're an alliance. And Iran created Hezbollah to control Lebanon, in the first place.

Some of this is from last year and earlier:

Iran's secret talks with Iraqi militants spark fears of proxy war
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2006/03/19/wiran119.xml&sSheet=/news/2006/03/19/ixworld.html

"The Iraqi firebrand cleric, Moqtadr al-Sadr and the chief of the armed Shia group Hizbollah in Lebanon, Hassan Nasrallah, held separate consultations with leading officials in Teheran.

Al-Sadr commands thousands of fighters in Iraq, with the power to destabilise further the country and target British and American troops, while Hizbollah's missile-wielding fighters are stationed on Lebanon's southern border with Israel. The revelation of their visits to Teheran has stoked fears that Iran's Shia clerical rulers are drawing up plans to wage a co-ordinated proxy war, using foreign Shia militias, in the worsening dispute with the West over its nuclear ambitions."

Hezbollah Said to Help Shiite Army in Iraq
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/28/world/middleeast/28military.html

"The official said that 1,000 to 2,000 fighters from the Mahdi Army and other Shiite militias had been trained by Hezbollah in Lebanon. A small number of Hezbollah operatives have also visited Iraq to help with training, the official said."

Iran Establishes Missile Defense Shield in Syria
http://www2.nysun.com/article/57236

"Iran is preparing to transfer dozens of medium-range Shahab-3 and Russian-made Scud-C missiles, together with Scud-B missiles. Most of the missiles can be fired from mobile launchers and are capable of hitting targets right across Israel."

"Besides shipping the weapons, Iran has also sent missile engineers to help to train the Syrian military and Hezbollah, the Lebanese Shiite Muslim group with which Israel fought last year's war.

In addition, Iran is reported to have made similar arrangements with the Sudanese government to enable it to attack pro-Western Arab countries, such as Saudi Arabia."

Hundreds of Iranian Troops Fighting in Lebanon
http://www2.nysun.com/article/36326

"Another foreign source, based in Washington, said the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps contingent in Lebanon is based in Beirut and in the Bekaa Valley. He said the troops usually number a few dozen, but that the size of the force increased in connection with the hostilities that have broken out between Israel and Iran's proxy, Hezbollah, over the past week.

The sources said the Iranians had directly operated a radar-guided C–802 missile that Iran acquired from Communist China and that hit an Israeli navy missile boat off the coast of Lebanon on Friday, killing four Israeli seamen."

"The Hezbollah offensive against Israel followed a summit in Damascus. Reports vary on whether the meeting was attended by Sheik Nasrallah himself or by one of his top political aides, Sheik Hussein Khalil. Others said to be present include the head of Syrian military intelligence, Assef Shawkat, and the Iranian national security adviser, Ali Larijani, who is one of the many high-ranking Iranian officials who have been shuttling between Damascus and Tehran."

New Syria-Iranian defense treaty opens way for Iran`s Revolutionary Guards to deploy on Israel’s Golan border by summer’s end
http://www.debka.com/headline.php?hid=2682

"They have learned that Iran has offered to deploy Revolutionary Guards on the Golan border with Israel by the end of summer, because as Najjar said at the signing: “We have a common front against Israel’s threats.”

DEBKAfile’s Tehran sources disclose the Iranians seek to attain three objectives by deploying RG units to the Golan heights:

1. Another direct front line against Israel.

2. A forward position for an Iranian electronic warning station to sound a timely alarm of the takeoff of American warplanes or missiles from the eastern Mediterranean basin on their way to attack.

3. The station can also keep electronic track of movements on Israeli air and missile bases, covering also Arrow anti-missile missile systems.

The Syrian military delegation, which spent five days in Tehran, brought a year of secret negotiations to their conclusion. The breadth of Syrian-Iranian military relations can be measured by the military treaty’s financial scope of $800 m and the size of the delegation Damascus sent to Tehran - 60 officers representing every branch of the Syrian armed forces, including intelligence and munitions industries.

For years, both countries have supported the Lebanese Hezbollah militia and anti-Israeli Palestinian factions including Hamas and Islamic Jihad, which maintain headquarters in Damascus."


Christ, I already posted on some of this stuff:

http://www.dcjunkies.com/showthread.php?t=4111&page=2

Wait til you hear the latest -

There's a "leak" that Israel will soon declassify some details of their strike last September in Syria. Supposedly they hit a plant built by North Korea, where the Iranians were helping the Syrians weaponize what was once Saddam's WMD, smuggled out before the war.

[Smurf-Herder]

Bill, whoever we or Israel fight, it's all Iran; whether directly or indirectly. They're the money and brains behind everything. And they're using all fronts.

And unless the Iranian leadership changes, we will eventually be fighting Iran. Because they're into everything going on over there. The thing is, the longer it takes to happen, the worse it will be. Unless of course, the Iranians somehow change what they've been doing for nearly 30 years.

[Bill]

Then attack Iran, attack Syria, attack Hezbollah, go ahead, I want you to do it.

Hezbollah came into existence on it's own, as a shia organization in lebanon. Iran supports them because iran supports all shia against the sunni. The sunni/shia hatred is almost 1300 years old.

Saying Iran created them is the same as saying the US created the right wing death squads in Columbia. The US didn't create them, it just funds and equips them, because we have an interest in stopping the workers in Columbia from organizing.

It doesn't matter to me what stories you have to tell to get Bush to attack.

Just do it.

[Bill]

Yeah, I heard that Israeli officials told Japanese officials details about the attacks in syria last month - the first official confrmation from israel that they believed they were detroying an NK nuclear processing plant.

That's great news - it brings us closer to war.

Hopefully Cheney will be able to use it to push for attack.

[Moby]

Personally, I think you are giving bush the lesser too much credit - I think he's not that sneaky.
I don't think Bush is sneaky at all. I also don't think that he's in charge.

Have you read the names of the people involved with The PNAC? They almost pulled off Watergate and that was when many were young pups. Now they're sneaky enough to pull it off.

[Bill]

Now they're sneaky enough to pull it off.

If so, then it's what america deserves.

Nothing can stop the wars.

If we experience pain early, it may educate americans enough so that we can start switching to the electricity economy, and prevent a much worse fate.

Americans aren't smart enough to make wise decisions at this stage - pain is our best hope.

[Bill]

maybe this will help you republicans get off the pot...

Iran tests advanced centrifuge

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080408/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iran_nuclear?1

President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad announced major progress in Iran's push for nuclear power, saying Tuesday that his nation was installing thousands of new uranium-enriching centrifuges and testing a much faster version of the device.

Ahmadinejad said scientists were putting 6,000 new centrifuges into place, about twice the current number, and testing a new type that works five times faster.

That would represent a major expansion of uranium enrichment — a process that can produce either fuel for a nuclear reactor or material for a warhead. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice cautioned, however, that the claim could not be immediately substantiated.

Diplomats close to the U.N. nuclear watchdog agency say Iran has exaggerated its progress and seen problems operating the 3,000 centrifuges already in place. One diplomat said Ahmadinejad's claims of a more advanced centrifuge appeared to allude to a type known as the IR-2, which the agency and Iran said months ago that Iran had begun testing.

While expressing concern that Iran continued to defy a U.N. Security Council ban on enrichment, a diplomat said that Ahmadinejad's announcement "seems to be little more than a publicity stunt." He spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to comment publicly.

The IR-2 is believed to be two to three times faster than the centrifuges currently in use, and his claim that the new machine was five times as quick added to the skepticism of the diplomats.

Permanent members of the Security Council, which has already imposed three sets of sanctions against Iran for its refusal to suspend uranium enrichment, were divided in their response to the announcement.

The United States and Britain quickly condemned it, and France warned that Iran could face more sanctions. But Russia, an ally of Iran, dismissed the need for that, saying negotiators were preparing a new package of incentives aimed at persuading Iran to freeze uranium enrichment.

Iran rejected a standing package of incentives endorsed by the five Security Council members plus Germany last week. Tehran says its nuclear program is intended only to produce energy, not develop weapons as the U.S. and many of its allies fear.

Iran has about 3,000 centrifuges operating at its underground nuclear facility in Natanz. That is the commonly accepted figure for a nuclear enrichment program that is past the experimental stage and can be used as a platform for a full industrial-scale program that could churn out enough enriched material for dozens of nuclear weapons over time.

[Smurf-Herder]

Then attack Iran, attack Syria, attack Hezbollah, go ahead, I want you to do it.

Hezbollah came into existence on it's own, as a shia organization in lebanon. Iran supports them because iran supports all shia against the sunni. The sunni/shia hatred is almost 1300 years old.

Saying Iran created them is the same as saying the US created the right wing death squads in Columbia. The US didn't create them, it just funds and equips them, because we have an interest in stopping the workers in Columbia from organizing.

It doesn't matter to me what stories you have to tell to get Bush to attack.

Just do it.


Iran sent people over to Lebanon to organize Hezbollah, modeled after the Iranian Hezbollah. You don't know your history.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hezbollah

"Hezbollah[1] (Arabic: حزب الله‎ ḥizba-llāh,[2] literally "party of Allah") is a Shi'a Islamic political and paramilitary organization based in Lebanon. The group's official name in Arabic is Hizb Allah Al-moqawama Al-Islamiyah fi Lubnan.[3]

Hezbollah first emerged during the Lebanese Civil War in the early 1980s as a militia of Shia followers of the Ayatollah Khomeini, trained, organized and funded by a contingent of Iranian Revolutionary Guards.[4] In its 1985 manifesto Hezbollah listed its three main goals as the eradication of Western colonialism in Lebanon, the bringing to justice of those who committed atrocities during the war (specifically the Phalangists), and the establishment of an Islamic government in Lebanon."