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LadyMod at scam.com
12-16-2007, 08:47 AM
Please, someone STOP that asshole before a free America is only a memory.

Wider Spying Fuels Aid Plan for Telecom Industry (http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/16/washington/16nsa.html?_r=1&th&emc=th&oref=slogin)
By ERIC LICHTBLAU, JAMES RISEN and SCOTT SHANE
Published: December 16, 2007
This article is by Eric Lichtblau, James Risen and Scott Shane.

WASHINGTON — For months, the Bush administration has waged a high-profile campaign, including personal lobbying by President Bush and closed-door briefings by top officials, to persuade Congress to pass legislation protecting companies from lawsuits for aiding the National Security Agency’s warrantless eavesdropping program.

But the battle is really about something much bigger. At stake is the federal government’s extensive but uneasy partnership with industry to conduct a wide range of secret surveillance operations in fighting terrorism and crime.

The N.S.A.’s reliance on telecommunications companies is broader and deeper than ever before, according to government and industry officials, yet that alliance is strained by legal worries and the fear of public exposure.

To detect narcotics trafficking, for example, the government has been collecting the phone records of thousands of Americans and others inside the United States who call people in Latin America, according to several government officials who spoke on the condition of anonymity because the program remains classified. But in 2004, one major phone carrier balked at turning over its customers’ records. Worried about possible privacy violations or public relations problems, company executives declined to help the operation, which has not been previously disclosed.

In a separate N.S.A. project, executives at a Denver phone carrier, Qwest, refused in early 2001 to give the agency access to their most localized communications switches, which primarily carry domestic calls, according to people aware of the request, which has not been previously reported. They say the arrangement could have permitted neighborhood-by-neighborhood surveillance of phone traffic without a court order, which alarmed them.

The federal government’s reliance on private industry has been driven by changes in technology. Two decades ago, telephone calls and other communications traveled mostly through the air, relayed along microwave towers or bounced off satellites. The N.S.A. could vacuum up phone, fax and data traffic merely by erecting its own satellite dishes. But the fiber optics revolution has sent more and more international communications by land and undersea cable, forcing the agency to seek company cooperation to get access.

After the disclosure two years ago that the N.S.A. was eavesdropping on the international communications of terrorism suspects inside the United States without warrants, more than 40 lawsuits were filed against the government and phone carriers. As a result, skittish companies and their lawyers have been demanding stricter safeguards before they provide access to the government and, in some cases, are refusing outright to cooperate, officials said.

“It’s a very frayed and strained relationship right now, and that’s not a good thing for the country in terms of keeping all of us safe,” said an industry official who believes that immunity is critical for the phone carriers. “This episode has caused companies to change their conduct in a variety of ways.”

With a vote in the Senate on the issue expected as early as Monday, the Bush administration has intensified its efforts to win retroactive immunity for companies cooperating with counterterrorism operations.

“The intelligence community cannot go it alone,” Mike McConnell, the director of national intelligence, wrote in a New York Times Op-Ed article Monday urging Congress to pass the immunity provision. “Those in the private sector who stand by us in times of national security emergencies deserve thanks, not lawsuits.”

Attorney General Michael B. Mukasey echoed that theme in an op-ed article of his own in The Los Angeles Times on Wednesday, saying private companies would be reluctant to provide their “full-hearted help” if they were not given legal protections.

The government’s dependence on the phone industry, driven by the changes in technology and the Bush administration’s desire to expand surveillance capabilities inside the United States, has grown significantly since the Sept. 11 attacks. The N.S.A., though, wanted to extend its reach even earlier. In December 2000, agency officials wrote a transition report to the incoming Bush administration, saying the agency must become a “powerful, permanent presence” on the commercial communications network, a goal that they acknowledged would raise legal and privacy issues.

While the N.S.A. operates under restrictions on domestic spying, the companies have broader concerns — customers’ demands for privacy and shareholders’ worries about bad publicity.

PAGE 2 (http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/16/washington/16nsa.html?pagewanted=2&_r=1&th&emc=th)

Frankg
12-16-2007, 10:44 AM
FACT: WIRETAPS SAVE LIVES
http://blogs.abcnews.com/theblotter/2006/08/the_anatomy_of_.html

Islam Rocks!
12-16-2007, 10:53 AM
FACT: WIRETAPS SAVE LIVES
http://blogs.abcnews.com/theblotter/2006/08/the_anatomy_of_.htmlFrank did I miss something? The artical didn't mention wiretapes.

hdmarketing
12-16-2007, 10:54 AM
Well if you are't doing anything wrong, then you shouldn't have anything to worry about.

I record every call that comes into my business.

When a caller calls my business number they are informed that this call may be monitored for train ing purposes.

This covers me in that I informed the caller they are being recorded for legal reasons.

It also gives me a record of calls with hreats in them.

LadyMod at scam.com
12-16-2007, 12:13 PM
Well if you are't doing anything wrong, then you shouldn't have anything to worry about.

That's a lame and typical response.

There have been Americans who were arrested and they hadn't done a damn thing wrong except to know someone who happened to be on some black list. It's another illegal invasion on our private lives.


I record every call that comes into my business.

When a caller calls my business number they are informed that this call may be monitored for training purposes.

This covers me in that I informed the caller they are being recorded for legal reasons.

It also gives me a record of calls with hreats in them.

And are the calls used for "training" purposes? Or is that just a lie? I just tell them I record all my calls. They can either stay on or drop off. No little white lies.

And considering you passed the "Psychopath (http://dcjunkies.com/showthread.php?p=28862#post28862)" test it doesn't surprise me you would fear getting a threat.

That's how psychopaths think. Except other psychopaths aren't going to leave a message that can be traced, especially on your business line.


:lmao2:

LadyMod at scam.com
12-16-2007, 12:14 PM
FACT: WIRETAPS SAVE LIVES
http://blogs.abcnews.com/theblotter/2006/08/the_anatomy_of_.html

So glad London is safe. Hasn't done a damned thing for the United States.


Schmuck

hdmarketing
12-16-2007, 12:48 PM
. And are the calls used for "training" purposes? Or is that just a lie? I just tell them I record all my calls. They can either stay on or drop off. No little white lies.

No I actually use those calls for training.

Although my wife is my only employee, I have meetngs with my contractor's and sub contractors and we go over a large number of calls once a week.


And considering you passed the "Psychopath (http://dcjunkies.com/showthread.php?p=28862#post28862)" test it doesn't surprise me you would fear getting a threat.
Lady Mod, it just so happens that in the Real Estate Business, people are very sue happy.
Someone goes into a home even when it's posted to KEEP OUT, and they trip on a 2x4, or step on a nail, or cut themself, they always ant to sue you.
When I record the calls I have some sort of proof if needed in court.

. That's how psychopaths think. Except other psychopaths aren't going to leave a message that can be traced, especially on your business line. :lmao2:

If you had half a brain you would be dangerous.:taunt:

LadyMod at scam.com
12-16-2007, 02:10 PM
Lady Mod, it just so happens that in the Real Estate Business, people are very sue happy.
Someone goes into a home even when it's posted to KEEP OUT, and they trip on a 2x4, or step on a nail, or cut themself, they always ant to sue you.
When I record the calls I have some sort of proof if needed in court.

My grandson's father is very successful flipping houses. If properly posted and you are insured no one can pervail against you in a courtroom. You don't need to record calls. LOL, of course you are paranoid so we understand why you feel the need.



If you had half a brain you would be dangerous.:taunt:

CTM, I'll put my half a brain up against your whole one any day of the week and still manage to best you every time.

Not bragging, just telling the truth.


:taunt:

disrupter
12-16-2007, 02:38 PM
Well i dropped AT&T as my long distance carrier & went with Qwest.

Didn't like Qwest's accounting scandal, but compared with protecting some of my privacy or not, hands down Qwest is my company.

Thank You Joe Nacchio. I hope you don't land in prison, because of the NSA & justice department's vendetta, although i do hope you pay back some of your questionable profits.

hdmarketing
12-16-2007, 03:11 PM
My grandson's father is very successful flipping houses. If properly posted and you are insured no one can pervail against you in a courtroom. You don't need to record calls. LOL, of course you are paranoid so we understand why you feel the need.

We are well insured, and I have a retained a lawyer and other agents.

You say I don't need to record calls, but I feel the need to, as well as review them for matters on how to handle certain situations.
It's just good business practice Lady Mod, and it is totally legal.

Of course, YOU were the one who started this thread titled "This is scary", so I figured it was YOU who is paranoid that "someone is listning to YOU and is going to get YOU!!!"

Like I said, if you arn't doing anything wrong, you have no reason to be afraid.

mwillman
12-16-2007, 03:15 PM
I'm just glad that in my state you have to give someone notice that you are recording the call or you are breaking the law.

disrupter
12-16-2007, 03:16 PM
if you record phone calls aren't you required to inform people?

except if you are an outlaw, like the NSA.

hdmarketing
12-16-2007, 03:47 PM
I'm just glad that in my state you have to give someone notice that you are recording the call or you are breaking the law.

It's the law here in AZ too.

if you record phone calls aren't you required to inform people?

except if you are an outlaw, like the NSA.

Did you miss the part where I said:

I record every call that comes into my business.

When a caller calls my business number they are informed that this call may be monitored for training purposes.

This covers me in that I informed the caller they are being recorded for legal reasons.

Specifically the recorded message says exactly worded, "This call may or may not be monitored or recorded for training or legal purpose".
Then it gives a list of options and fowards the call to the proper extention, ie my office, my pager, or my voice mailbox.

mwillman
12-16-2007, 03:49 PM
I dont have a problem when im given the choice to be recorded but thats not what has been going on.

To the current regime we are guilty until proven innocent and that goes against what this country stands for.

Moby
12-16-2007, 04:36 PM
FACT: WIRETAPS SAVE LIVES
http://blogs.abcnews.com/theblotter/2006/08/the_anatomy_of_.html
Fact. Watergate was about illegal electronic surveillance. It was being used to destroy democracy.

Since many of the same people are in the administration now that were involved with Watergate, what does that tell you?