CNN airs footage of Iraq sniper attacks

[boortzland]

As far as i am concerned CNN & or the reporter are guilty of treason for not wanring American soldiers or for not trying to stop these attack. I guess the story was more important.



SEATTLE POST-INTELLIGENCER
http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/tv/1401AP_TV_CNN_Snipers.html

Thursday, October 19, 2006 · Last updated 5:39 p.m. PT

CNN airs footage of Iraq sniper attacks

By DAVID BAUDER
AP TELEVISION WRITER

NEW YORK -- A CNN executive said Thursday the network's effort to present the "unvarnished truth" about the Iraq war led it to televise portions of a video that shows insurgent snipers targeting U.S. military personnel.

The tape, which came to the network unexpectedly through contact with an insurgent leader, was aired first Wednesday night on "Anderson Cooper 360" and repeated on Thursday.

In one instance, the tape shows a uniformed member of the U.S. military milling in a public area with Iraqis. A shot rings out. CNN fades the screen to black before the result - described as a victim falling forward - is visible.

It's one of 10 separate sniper attacks on Americans documented on the tape, which CNN technicians concluded was authentic, said David Doss, executive producer of Cooper's show, in a Web log entry describing the network's decision what to show.

CNN could not determine the identity of any of the sniper victims, spokeswoman Christa Robinson said.

Baghdad correspondent Michael Ware had been in contact through intermediaries with Ibrahim al-Shammari, a leader for the rebel group Islamic Army. Ware had sent al-Shammari a series of questions about the insurgency in Iraq, Doss explained.

In reply, al-Shammari sent two tapes. One reportedly showed him, with face concealed, responding to the questions. The other showed the sniper incidents, seemingly taken by the insurgents themselves, CNN said.

CNN understood that some critics might find that the tape had public relations benefits for the insurgency, Doss wrote.

"We also understood that this kind of footage is upsetting and disturbing for many viewers," he said. "But after getting beyond the emotional debate, we concluded the tape meets our criteria for newsworthiness."

The decision was subject to "hours of intense editorial debate" at CNN's highest levels, he said.

Doss said he had already received several angry responses from viewers of Wednesday's five-minute report, some wondering whether CNN was helping the enemy and others concerned that the tape was inappropriate for young viewers who may have happened upon it.

"Whether or not you agree with us in this case, our goal, as always, is to present the unvarnished truth as best we can," Doss said.

[Tommy]

Hi Boortz
its always nice when you swing by :-)

I seen that and they reported that the tape was passed on to the media from an insurgant group

so that means CNN wasnt present when the tape was shot
and they made it perfectly clear that the tape was months old

they said that the european press had the tape months ago

even your own post has this line

The tape, which came to the network unexpectedly through contact with an insurgent leader, was aired first Wednesday night on "Anderson Cooper 360" and repeated on Thursday.

[Bill]

Ah, dude, these were videos shot by the Iraqis.

They've been available on the internet for months.

CNN just played the videos that half the world has already seen.

http://www.dcjunkies.com/showthread.php?t=300

[boortzland]

Hi Boortz
its always nice when you swing by :-)

I seen that and they reported that the tape was passed on to the media from an insurgant group

so that means CNN wasnt present when the tape was shot
and they made it perfectly clear that the tape was months old

they said that the european press had the tape months ago

even your own post has this line

The tape, which came to the network unexpectedly through contact with an insurgent leader, was aired first Wednesday night on "Anderson Cooper 360" and repeated on Thursday.

A CNN spokes person was just played on Rush Limbaugh's show, who indicated that they had an exclusive with these guys. The tape i heard last night, a CNN reporter was doing "play by play" of the shooting while it was in progress.

I'm sorry, but if CNN is going to be "IN BED" with terrorist snipers, then they need to move their HQ out of my town (ATL) and move it to Bagdad.

[Tommy]

Boortz

Cmon...... this partisan stuff is blinding you
at least be reasonable

the reason they were doing a play by play is because last night

they had all these experts from the marines analyzing the tape
and refuting the insurgents claims


marine snipers were going over every frame right in the CNN studios

I seen the whole thing last night
there is no way the tape was shot by anybody but an insurgent

and again CNN was very clear that the tape had been out there in circulation for a few months and been shown on numerous European news shows


Rush Limbaugh is a partisan pittbull
can you really trust somebody like that when they have such a strong loyality to one side

[Tommy]

I'm sorry, but if CNN is going to be "IN BED" with terrorist snipers, then they need to move their HQ out of my town (ATL) and move it to Bagdad.

well maybe you will see that they really didnt have anything to do with producung the tape and then you will let them stay here in the usa :lmao2:

[boortzland]

Boortz

Cmon...... this partisan stuff is blinding you
at least be reasonable

the reason they were doing a play by play is because last night

they had all these experts from the marines analyzing the tape
and refuting the insurgents claims


marine snipers were going over every frame right in the CNN studios

I seen the whole thing last night
there is no way the tape was shot by anybody but an insurgent

and again CNN was very clear that the tape had been out there in circulation for a few months and been shown on numerous European news shows


Rush Limbaugh is a partisan pittbull
can you really trust somebody like that when they have such a strong loyality to one side

I dont need Rush's support, but for the record, Rush is on the money most of the time. He is a strong conservative. If that makes him a pittbull, then put me in that camp.

Even if CNN didnt shoot the tape, they glorified the assasinations for the insurgents by airing them on the largest cable news network worldwide. If they had any patriotism at all, they would have reported the existance of the tapes without airing them. They just couldnt resist feeding the American TV bloodlust. It's like when they shot video of the fire on the water when flight 800 went down. Americans were glued to 12 hours of LIVE video of floating debris, and fire in the water.

So, you libs go to the polls, vote for the Dem's, and weaken the USA. One day you will be speaking Arabic, carrying a prayer rug, and freedom will be just a memory.

Pittbulls like Rush Limbaugh, Mike Savage, Sean Hannity, & Neal Boortz are needed in this country to insure that someone is defending this country, instead of giving our soverinty away to the likes of the UN.

[Bill]

Well, Tommy, you have to give Boortz credit for having the vision to claim that the solution to a .308 bullet thru the brain - is silencing the American media.

That'll teach them Iraqis not to mess with the US!

We got rid of the pesky Habeus Corpus - let's just grab all the reporters, and toss 'em into the secret prisons.

No news is good news!

[Tommy]

I dont need Rush's support, but for the record, Rush is on the money most of the time. He is a strong conservative. If that makes him a pittbull, then put me in that camp.


isnt he a drug addict ?????
so I guess that puts you in that camp also :lmao2:


I dont beleive people like him, Hannity and Oberman are fair
their loyaltys clearly lie with their partys

you should at LEAST see the tape or the news broadcast FIRST HAND before posting such a contversal and damaging opinion

and nothing was glorified the bad parts were cut out
just like Fox does when they show peices of a bin laden tape
I guess that means Sean hannity shot all those bin laden tapes cause they were on his show


and isnt Fox the biggest cable news network ???
at least thats what they keep telling us
not CNN like your post said


Boortz
there are two sides to every story
if your just gonna listen to partisan hacks and close your mind
then you my friend are a large part of the biggest problem with this country

[Moby]

Boortz, while I agree that videos of watching Americans die is terrible and I certainly don't want to see it, do you think that Americans should continue to see only sanitized reports about the war?

I think anyone that supports any war should have to see the death and the destruction caused by the war.

I also don't get the impression that the CNN reporters had any chance to stop the snipers since they got the tapes after the killings occurred.

[Moby]

I dont need Rush's support, but for the record, Rush is on the money most of the time.
I haven't listen to Rush in years but when I would catch him on the radio he spoke mostly from his own opinions and ignored a lot of facts.

[Tommy]

So, you libs go to the polls, vote for the Dem's, and weaken the USA. One day you will be speaking Arabic, carrying a prayer rug, and freedom will be just a memory.


that's a little funny, I remember that you were the one in favor of bringing religion back in to the schools

remember the school prayer thread ???
ohhh but forgive me.... that was ok.... cause that was your religion :taunt:

[boortzland]

Boortz, while I agree that videos of watching Americans die is terrible and I certainly don't want to see it, do you think that Americans should continue to see only sanitized reports about the war?

I think anyone that supports any war should have to see the death and the destruction caused by the war.

I also don't get the impression that the CNN reporters had any chance to stop the snipers since they got the tapes after the killings occurred.

No, I'm not for any kind of sensorship. CNN can do what the hell they want. I think they should have used better judgement in what they put out. These are our commarades, our soldiers, our blood. Its one thing to play a tape of a psyco like Bin Laden talking about what he's going to do, or what he did, but it's a completely different story to show some RAG HEAD BASTARD SHOOTING A US MARINE MEDIC IN THE BACK.

I'm sorry, but if you as an AMERICAN are willing to tolerate this from the media, then you should just freaking move! Some of you have suggested on this site that you might do that anyway. (dont let the screen door hit you in the ass)
No, dont censor CNN. Sell off your stock in AOL/TimeWarner, protest CNN Center in ATlanta, write congressmen, make their lives miserable. Write letters to their advertisers. You know, freedom of speech...just like that damn video.
Next thing you know, they will be reporting about mussilim celebrations around the world because of the video. Just GREAT!

As far as seeing death and destruction..been there dude...during the Carter (whimp) & Regan administrations...fins, and boots on the ground Iran 1980.

[boortzland]

that's a little funny, I remember that you were the one in favor of bringing religion back in to the schools

remember the school prayer thread ???
ohhh but forgive me.... that was ok.... cause that was your religion :taunt:

If you read my comments, they were referring to INDOCTRINATION OF RELIGION...in a Mussilim USA, you would be REQUIRED to carry the preverbial "PRAYER RUG". That was my point.

As for schools...thats another issue for another thread. That thread was more about the generic term "UNDER GOD".

[Abnormalia]

No, I'm not for any kind of sensorship. CNN can do what the hell they want. I think they should have used better judgement in what they put out. These are our commarades, our soldiers, our blood. Its one thing to play a tape of a psyco like Bin Laden talking about what he's going to do, or what he did, but it's a completely different story to show some RAG HEAD BASTARD SHOOTING A US MARINE MEDIC IN THE BACK.

I'm sorry, but if you as an AMERICAN are willing to tolerate this from the media, then you should just freaking move! Some of you have suggested on this site that you might do that anyway. (dont let the screen door hit you in the ass)
No, dont censor CNN. Sell off your stock in AOL/TimeWarner, protest CNN Center in ATlanta, write congressmen, make their lives miserable. Write letters to their advertisers. You know, freedom of speech...just like that damn video.
Next thing you know, they will be reporting about mussilim celebrations around the world because of the video. Just GREAT!

As far as seeing death and destruction..been there dude...during the Carter (whimp) & Regan administrations...fins, and boots on the ground Iran 1980.


Hmmm, I'd take the opposite view. I think seeing these tapes give equal benefit to both parties (i'll get to morality in a moment). A person can view the tape and ask "Why the hell are we over there?" Another person will view the tape and ask "Why the hell don't we have enough anti-sniper units over there?"

As for morality, people need to know what's happening over there, even if it means showing blood and death. It's real, not fake. The media won't flood itself with gore, but showing it is in no way a bad thing. However, just watching that 'Helicopter Kills' video over and over makes me shiver- literally.

[Tommy]

there was no blood or death on those tapes

i mean people were about to get killed but they never showed those parts

but then the marine sniper came on and said that shot was a miss
you can see it hit here.... but the insurgents on the tape are saying its a hit and again the marine sniper would point out other parts where they were just completly full of shit

i didn't find it offensive at all

it was more of soldiers standing around with the praise Allah BS being said in Arabic( or whatever they call that shit) and then the tape gets cut off


there is NO WAY anybody who seen the original broadcast would think that CNN was actually there

[Moby]

I'm sorry, but if you as an AMERICAN are willing to tolerate this from the media, then you should just freaking move!
Help me understand why it's wrong for the media to show an American being shot?

Your first statement was that it was an act of treason but the comment above seems to take your argument in a different direction and towards a different point that I'm not following.

Network television shows rape, murder and most forms of violence on a regular basis while American families that consider themselves moral are watching it with their children.

I may not like it but as I said before I think that everyone that supports the war should see the killings.

[Tommy]

Boortz

would you at least agree that calling it treason is a very serious thing to say and someone saying that should at least be getting their info first hand instead of the old..... he said, she said BS

the only thing we have agreed on so far is that

I seen the broadcast, and you didn't

[Moby]

the only thing we have agreed on so far is that

I seen the broadcast, and you didn't
Yes but Tommy he was listening to Rush. Isn't that better then seeing something with your own eyes? :lmao2:

[Tommy]

Yes but Tommy he was listening to Rush. Isn't that better then seeing something with your own eyes? :lmao2:

who knows what Rush seen
maybe he fell of the wagon and was high again :)

a lot of those drugs are supposed to make you paranoid and delusional
(which explains a lot about the GOP)


this guy was/is a drug addict... and to them its perfectly ok

he broke the law and got a sweetheart deal and thats perfectly ok also

he yaks about family values and is found with viagra and of course he isnt married ... and thats ok

[boortzland]

Help me understand why it's wrong for the media to show an American being shot?

Why should i even dignify this question with an answer? Damn, man are you even from here? Why would any American want to see that? It sure as hell is not entertainment.
Your first statement was that it was an act of treason but the comment above seems to take your argument in a different direction and towards a different point that I'm not following.

:rant: If I'm not clear, I'm on a bit of a rant. I just do not understand any American would support a network that would put something like this on the air. I'm not talking about "the right" to put it on the air, but CNN :banghead:

Network television shows rape, murder and most forms of violence on a regular basis while American families that consider themselves moral are watching it with their children.

I may not like it but as I said before I think that everyone that supports the war should see the killings.
You cant compare "Law And Order" to CNN showing a sniper shooting our troops. It's just not the same.

[Abnormalia]

I love cheese


Err..I'm an American, but I think everyone's life is equally sacred. With that in mind, i've seen plenty of other people getting killed by the US in Iraq, but why not see our people get killed? It's equally tragic.

[boortzland]

who knows what Rush seen
maybe he fell of the wagon and was high again :)

a lot of those drugs are supposed to make you paranoid and delusional
(which explains a lot about the GOP)


this guy was/is a drug addict... and to them its perfectly ok

he broke the law and got a sweetheart deal and thats perfectly ok also

he yaks about family values and is found with viagra and of course he isnt married ... and thats ok

I didnt get the story from Rush. But i suppose you guys have more CREDIBLE SOURCES, like for example CNN. You guys copy stories from on-line news sources and site them as credible without in most cases even knowing who wrote them. Rush is a target because he has influence. He has influence because a large segment of conservitive find him to be credible. Him taking prescrition pain killers does not make his opinions any less credible. Today is the 1st day I've turned Rush on in 4 years. I tuned in to listen to the conversation on this isssue.

[Abnormalia]

I didnt get the story from Rush. But i suppose you guys have more CREDIBLE SOURCES, like for example CNN. You guys copy stories from on-line news sources and site them as credible without in most cases even knowing who wrote them. Rush is a target because he has influence. He has influence because a large segment of conservitive find him to be credible. Him taking prescrition pain killers does not make his opinions any less credible. Today is the 1st day I've turned Rush on in 4 years. I tuned in to listen to the conversation on this isssue.


Today is the most boring day in 4 years?
*ding ding ding*
The Angry Internet for 400, Alex.

I tend to view information, and then make my own decisions. You have made yours, and we have made ours. I really, really don't think we have to cite anything. This is a concept question, not an event persay. In concept, I have no problem with the media showing the truth about war, hell, remember when Sadam's son's were killed? What did you think about them being shown on network television, gore and all?

[boortzland]

Err..I'm an American, but I think everyone's life is equally sacred. With that in mind, i've seen plenty of other people getting killed by the US in Iraq, but why not see our people get killed? It's equally tragic.

Where have you seen Iraqis being killed? CNN? You may have seen scenes in the aftermath, but where & when did you see video of any Iraqi being killed, not dead, but being killed?

War is always hell. Full of violence, blood & guts, etc. But that does not mean we should be doing play by play on TV like its the world series. Then the pudits can try to micormanage the war and criticize the leadership, all the way down to the troops, all for ratings and a left-wing liberal agenda.

All of this stuff emboldens our enimies, and underminds our soldiers, putting them in more danger. If a marine gets trigger shy because he is worried about showing up on CNN (a real possibility these days) he could end up dead because of it.

My opinion is, the press has no place in a war zone. If them being there underminds our efforts, or endangers our soldiers, i say get them out.

I understand CNN had reporters with the Iraqis before the invasion of Iraq and refused to communicate with the American military for fear of loosing their ringside seat for the start of the war.

[boortzland]

Today is the most boring day in 4 years?
*ding ding ding*
The Angry Internet for 400, Alex.

I tend to view information, and then make my own decisions. You have made yours, and we have made ours. I really, really don't think we have to cite anything. This is a concept question, not an event persay. In concept, I have no problem with the media showing the truth about war, hell, remember when Sadam's son's were killed? What did you think about them being shown on network television, gore and all?

I do not beleive showing them dead was called for either.

[Abnormalia]

I do not beleive showing them dead was called for either.


Alright, then you're very consistent. You would prefer no videos of actual deaths on TV as you might equate that to "Faces of Death" or similar- respectable

That would be nice, even in my case, but we've already gone too far- We've seen Iraqi deaths, and now we're seeing American deaths.

War's hell.

[Linkster]

I guess I dont understand why we stopped showing war deaths on TV? Seems to me when I was a teenager/college it was on the news networks every night showing US soldiers getting killed, carried out of the jungle on rigged poncho stretchers, shipped home in caskets etc etc
It also seemed that the American people understood it to be what it was - news reporting - not for any sides causes - but plain reporting.

Its a shame that we have become so offended we cant even give respect to the flag draped boxes coming home to Delaware anymore - it used to be shown on TV every night - but now we are hiding it for some reason??? Wehna government starts to hide things from the public or not allow specific events to be shown on tv, it would seem the people of the US have the right to start asking questions as to why? Of course I blame the "feel-good" entertainment media for the problem, but as far as I can tell they are too scared to report anything investigative (and Im talking real reporting) other than who killed the next cute blonde from the all-white school. Would be interesting to see them actually have a show on one of the many black kids that gets killed every day near their schools

[Bill]

I think CNN showed the videos to inspire patriotic fire in americans, and to get them to support the troops.

It explains why the war in Iraq is really going pretty well, all things considered.

I think it will inspire young men to join the army, to get a shot back at those dirty sniper Iraqis.

Who could possibly interpret it any other way?

[Abnormalia]

Dear media: I don't want to feel good. I want to see reality as it is. I want to witness a fatal car crash and hold a dying person in my arms.

[boortzland]

As I said before, seeing flag draped coffins, guys on streatchers, and the stuff we saw during the Vietnam era, is not the same as showing a sniper's view of him picking off an American Soldier. The media actually had some restraint during vietnam. By todays standards, what they showed was tame.

I lived across the street from a VA Hospital during that war, and saw the constant parade of medivac choppers brining in the guys. It was a surreal experience, since we were seeing TV images on the Evening news.

Linkster
I guess I dont understand why we stopped showing war deaths on TV? Seems to me when I was a teenager/college it was on the news networks every night showing US soldiers getting killed, carried out of the jungle on rigged poncho stretchers, shipped home in caskets etc etc
It also seemed that the American people understood it to be what it was - news reporting - not for any sides causes - but plain reporting.

They DID NOT SHOW THEM GETTING KILLED!

Linkster
Would be interesting to see them actually have a show on one of the many black kids that gets killed every day near their schools

Its one thing to show a dead body, and most times they are drapped, and another to show the actual death. Does anyone take into accout the trauma that would create for the families back home? Again I'm not talking sensorship, but a little good old fashioned American Pride. "What will this do to our country?"
I guess CNN's only concern is how many viewers will this get us. :crazzy:

[Abnormalia]

This reminds me of that one video from Iraq: The insurgenitals were filming themselves about to snipe a soldier, they fired, the soldier was knocked off his feet, quickly jumped up, did a weapons scan, and got behind the vehicle he was under (thank you vest). All the while, the terrrsts were alahickbarring it up. I wonder what they were thinking when he got back up and ran behind the car? It actually made me laugh : "Alah Ackbar alah ackbar *BANG* ALAH ACKBAR...alaha..um..ackbar..ala...SHIT"

Apparently, as the story goes, they were tracked down, and the soldier who was targeted gave first aid to the sniper who shot him in the first place.

[Linkster]

Boortz - I dont know where you grew up but in Wash DC - the news media certainly showed them getting killed in Vietnam - as well as the bloody bodies laying on the ground without anything covering them and guys with body parts laying next to them that had just been blown off by grenades...you may have had some censorship where you lived, but we sure didnt.

It was one of the prime movers of the anti-war movement back then - we would take the still photos they had in Life or another publication of a soldier laying like that on the ground and use it on our protest posters as examples of what would happen to dick and janes sons
I would also disagree that the media had restraint back then - and Im really glad they didnt or that war would have dragged on for another 20 years - I just wish these damned "offended" talking bobble heads they have on the news nowadays would get some guts and really start showing the horrors of war to mr and mrs suv - right now they think its all about putting a little yellow sticker on your car - and my opinion is its about the lamest thing the media idiots could do

For once I would love to see these (borrowing a phrase here) United States of the Offended - get something shown to them that would really offend enough for them to get off their lazy apathetic behinds and take part in this country as citizens instead of letting a few do it for them

[Tommy]

lets remember the origianl context of this thread


As far as i am concerned CNN & or the reporter are guilty of treason for not wanring American soldiers or for not trying to stop these attack. I guess the story was more important.


so Boortz do you still believe that CNN was there shooting this video
in bed with the insurgents ????

as Rush led you to believe




linkster, I just realized something about what you said


The right passes off the antiwar movement as anti American
like that the antiwar movement is being against the troops and that it hurts the troops


and I always bought in to that to but now I realize I was wrong


the ones that really care about the troops are the anti war movement
they are the ones out there marching to save the lives of our soldiers

think about Vietnam, that war would have gone on longer if it wasn't for the antiwar movement
so by causing the early withdrawal of troops that saved a lot of lives and limbs


the antiwar movement is nesseray in any war
because it pushes the politicians to end the war as soon as possible

it also pushes the politicians to do their best to keep down casualties because the more bloody a war is the more the antiwar movement will grow

[Linkster]

Tommy - thats the way I always thought about the anti-war movement (during Vietnam) and it was really pushed to the front of my thinking when I realized that half the people working in the offices we had in Wash DC for the movement were staffed by vets that had just come back from SE Asia - just as you see the current anti-war effort being supported by a huge amount of Iraq vets

[boortzland]

Anti-war protesters during Vietnam called the troops baby killers, and all sorts of other names. They are no different now. I can tell you as a vet, active duty troops do not feel that anti-war protesters are supporting the troops.

Tommy
so Boortz do you still believe that CNN was there shooting this video
in bed with the insurgents ????

as Rush led you to believe

I'll say it again. I tuned into Rush after I had listened to the broadcast on another station. Rush did not lead me to beleive anything.

What they did in the broadcast was almost as bad as being there. They gave the snipers an international forum to show the mussilim world how THEY are killing the infidels.

CNN has decided to take a "neutral" position, so that they can get the exclusive coverage from the perspective of the terrorist. They were in Bagdad before we invaded, and would not cooperate with US intelligence. At least Geraldo & Oliver North went in with our guys.

Anti-war protest in general, do very much harm to our troops. It emboldens our enimies, reduces morale among the troops, and also affects world opinion of the USA overseas when they see our own people, and politicians protesting our troops. It gives the impression to outsiders that because we have the freedom to protest, and do, that we are somehow a weaker nation. That puts us all in more danger, and will perpetuate countries who will want to challange us.
Tommy, I thought you & I were on the same page when i comes to stuff like defending freedom.

[Abnormalia]

Anti-war protesters during Vietnam called the troops baby killers, and all sorts of other names. They are no different now. I can tell you as a vet, active duty troops do not feel that anti-war protesters are supporting the troops.



I'll say it again. I tuned into Rush after I had listened to the broadcast on another station. Rush did not lead me to beleive anything.

What they did in the broadcast was almost as bad as being there. They gave the snipers an international forum to show the mussilim world how THEY are killing the infidels.

CNN has decided to take a "neutral" position, so that they can get the exclusive coverage from the perspective of the terrorist. They were in Bagdad before we invaded, and would not cooperate with US intelligence. At least Geraldo & Oliver North went in with our guys.

Anti-war protest in general, do very much harm to our troops. It emboldens our enimies, reduces morale among the troops, and also affects world opinion of the USA overseas when they see our own people, and politicians protesting our troops. It gives the impression to outsiders that because we have the freedom to protest, and do, that we are somehow a weaker nation. That puts us all in more danger, and will perpetuate countries who will want to challange us.
Tommy, I thought you & I were on the same page when i comes to stuff like defending freedom.


I'm anti war and I'm not saying they're baby killers :confused: .

Hell, I have people I know and friends of friends who are over there right now. They're cool men and women. They have no choice but be over there, it's a contract. My biggest fear right now is that my best highschool buddy is going to be sent over (He was in electronics training after bootcamp...suddenly, he was selected among others to get sent to a better barracks, where they were supervised by a single drill sargent, under much more lax conditions. It was also suggested to them that they'd get out of training much earlier...I'm not sure if they're telling the truth, or they're just buttering them up before they're sent off..I hope not)

[Bill]

I'm pro war, I love this war actually, but I have yet to hear anyone anywhere call our soldiers in Iraq babykillers.

Not that I hang out in antiwar rallies, for all I know it's just "babykiller this" and "babykiller that" all day long in the antiwar trenches.

But, war does kill babies, and if you don't want to think about that, you must be an american.

Because everyone else in the world is smart enough to know that war kills babies.

Lot's of babies. Piles of babies. Multiple piles of babies. Big piles of babies.

We could sort them into categories. Shot babies in this pile, shrapnel babies in that pile. Compression shock babies in several big piles. You got your burned babies, your crushed babies, your dysentery babies, probably some starved babies, lots of exposure babies.

Those are just our babies, we'd have to start a whole other area for the babies killed by the other side.

War kills babies. Get used to it. There's going to be a lot of war in this century, it's about time we start to love the baby killing.

[Linkster]

Anti-war protesters during Vietnam called the troops baby killers, and all sorts of other names. They are no different now. I can tell you as a vet, active duty troops do not feel that anti-war protesters are supporting the troops.


I dont know where you are getting your propaganda from but that is the biggest load of crap Ive ever seen - I was there - right in the middle of those demonstrations and never once saw anyone call someone a baby killer - and the only names I can remember calling troops was the same names we called them by when they were standing right next to us protesting - by their given names - you watch way too much TV or made up shit for movies or somthing off the wall
And every vet I live near here not only supports the antiwar effort nowadays - they see every day the protestors supporting not only the troops that are home, but the families of the troops still deployed
If youre going to spout off repeating what you hear on talk-radio you might fact check your info with real life people - not what you can find on the interweb or conservative radio shows that are dissing the troops every day

[Linkster]

Anti-war protest in general, do very much harm to our troops.
It emboldens our enimies, reduces morale among the troops, and also affects world opinion of the USA overseas when they see our own people, and politicians protesting our troops.
It gives the impression to outsiders that because we have the freedom to protest, and do, that we are somehow a weaker nation.
That puts us all in more danger, and will perpetuate countries who will want to challange us.
.
I just caught this - geez now I know you are listening to radio shows - you couldnt possibly make this BS up
I was of the impression that we wanted to project the image of a democracy - where people can protest peacefully without being shut down
Seems to me we are in Iraq right now promoting their choice of freedom and democracy so that they can protest when they want as well - and that we believe that makes them a stronger country - how does that all of a sudden make us weaker?
What danger does us protesting put our country in - that we still support freedom and democracy is the strongest statement any American could make

And finally - please stop listening to these idiots that keep repeating that anti-war means anti-troops - its a totally different ball of wax - as a matter of fact its exactly the opposite - the protestors are the strongest supporters of the troops - they want them out of harms way right now - so fewer of them get hurt or killed - and if thats not possible, at least give them the right tools to do their job instead of stealing the funds to finance corporate sponsors in Iraq's football parties

[boortzland]

I dont know where you are getting your propaganda from but that is the biggest load of crap Ive ever seen - I was there - right in the middle of those demonstrations and never once saw anyone call someone a baby killer - and the only names I can remember calling troops was the same names we called them by when they were standing right next to us protesting - by their given names - you watch way too much TV or made up shit for movies or somthing off the wall

No propaganda. I've been there too. Heard it with my own ears. Talk Radio is only a mouthpiece and forum to express ideas, opinions etc without the liberal media slant.

And every vet I live near here not only supports the antiwar effort nowadays - they see every day the protestors supporting not only the troops that are home, but the families of the troops still deployed
If youre going to spout off repeating what you hear on talk-radio you might fact check your info with real life people - not what you can find on the interweb or conservative radio shows that are dissing the troops every day
I dont know what vets you associate with, unless they started out as conciencious objectors, or bed wetting liberals, the vets I speak to frequently support the troops and have nothing but contempt for the Cindy Sheehan anti war nut cases.

You guys can sit here an pick at me, critcize my comments, my sources, and my positions. But in the end, only 1 thing matters. Those guys are standing between you and the terrorist. Showing one of them getting picked off (the original topic) does nothing to support them or their efforts. If you were a REAL AMERICAN, YOU WOULD BE OUTRAGED TOO.
:rant:

[boortzland]

Not calling them baby killers. Here's just on example from 2004
http://www.counterpunch.org/lindorff09252004.html

[boortzland]

March 28, 2003

We Never Spit on Any Babykillers
By CHRIS CLARKE


No, it would seem in fact that what people generally intend by the phrase is a defense against an old story told about those of us who opposed an earlier war now fading from the public consciousness. Thirty or so years ago, the story goes, poor beleaguered GIs returning from Vietnam were met with torrents of abuse from anti--war protesters. We called them "babykillers," we called them "Nazis," we spat on them, we contributed to the general sense of alienation that fostered the well known phenomenon of the Psychotic Vietnam Vet. If not for the antiwar movement, Vietnam vets would have folded neatly and unobtrusively back into society just as their Greatest Generation daddies did after Anzio.


Just another addition...i could find others?

[Bill]

I agree with Boortz.

Information about the war shouldn't be on the TV.

It should only be on the internet, where only adults who want to see it can find it. Or on the BBC, because nobody gives a shit about what the brits watch.

All I want to see on my TV is that big Saddam statue pulled down by an american engineering tank.

And happy Iraqi children clamoring for candy from an armored GI patrolling the streets of baghdad.

Really, when you think about it, it's the media that's responsible for snipers. Smipers only snipe to get on the news and embolden the enemy.

No media = no snipers.

Reporters = enemy combatants.

http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/local/states/california/northern_california/15811043.htm

[Moby]

Those guys are standing between you and the terrorist.
You're joking right? A fat angry drug addict that makes a living by spreading propaganda (you've quoted no actual facts so it must be nothing more then that) is actually standing between me and some terrorists?

You have really gone off the deep end. That drug addict is not fighting a war. He's filling his pocket.

[boortzland]

You're joking right? A fat angry drug addict that makes a living by spreading propaganda (you've quoted no actual facts so it must be nothing more then that) is actually standing between me and some terrorists?

You have really gone off the deep end. That drug addict is not fighting a war. He's filling his pocket.

What the F are you talking about? I've been talking about Marines, Sailors, Solidiers, and Airmen. If you are still stuck on Rush, YOU are the one with a problem.

What so-called facts have you brought to the table?? What credible sources? Get off Rush..he's beside the point. I hope Rush makes Billions!! Thats the American way! Free Market...if he can get it, more power to him. I know I'm going to try and make all i can. (petty envy):taunt:

[Linkster]

Lets see - based on your myspace profile you were 8 years old when I was protesting the Vietnam war - you were 15 when I was in the military - you were in college when I was still in the military - and just when did you see these protestors call anyone babykillers???

You are obviously pointing your references to people that are writing blogs as protest against the Iraq war - Im talking about the vietnam war - and if someone calls the current troops that have killed babies (which I believe this article is talking about - actual baby killers) then let them - I dont think they are protesting
As far as that other persons take on what happened when troops came home in Vietnam - I would be willing to take a guess that they either about your age or younger and are relying on heresay not actual physical being there seeing with your own eyes - because I was there - and we welcomed them home every time one of our buddies from High school came home alive - which wasnt very often - so I would appreciate it if you would stop spouting off stuff that you really didnt experience as if you did - I now can see you are just a keyboard warrior - and until now had a little respect for you as I thought you had actually served this country like I did - thats obviously not the case - youre just like all the other right wingers out there that "defend the troops" by staying behind and not volunteering for service or avoiding the draft like most of them did

[Abnormalia]

Wow, something took a giant dump on this thread. I'll flush:

Everyone is an individual, to label people who do or do not support the war into just 2 seperate groups is stupid. There are crazy, there are sane, there are extreme, and there are docile people.

[Linkster]

Just to show you some credible references - and some history so you can learn what really happened while you were still in the sandbox:
http://www.vvaw.org/about/
The Vietnam Veterans against the War - and they are still very active

Just a little quote from their history page here:
http://www.vvaw.org/about/warhistory.php
"The simple fact is that neither the American people nor the American GIs fighting in Vietnam thought that the goals -- real or imagined -- were worth the lives and the money being squandered. The war was lost on the battlefields of Vietnam and in the hearts and minds of the American people.

During the war, VVAW led tens of thousands of Vietnam vets in demonstrations against that war. No comparable group of Vietnam vets ever rose to challenge VVAW or our goals. When VVAW brought 1500 Vietnam vets to protest Nixon's renomination, the Republican Party could only come up with 6 vets to support the war -- and some of these did not support Nixon. Vietnam vets knew firsthand about the real war, and they opposed it."

And heres a picture of the Iraq Vets Against the War in New Orleans:
http://www.vvaw.org/gallery/NOLA_march06.php?which=13

[Linkster]

And of course some info back when your radio hosts were swiftboating Kerry - heres what the real soldiers said:
"VVAW does not endorse political candidates and has no current association with Senator John Kerry or his campaign, but believes in exposing lies disguised as news, whether the lies appear in a whole movie or in clips from it or in special "news" programs. "Back in April, 1971, when VVAW member John Kerry testified before Congress, he spoke for us; he spoke for all of the Vietnam vets who opposed the war and he spoke the truth, but he never called fellow soldiers war criminals or made the statements that Carlton Sherwood claims,"

[boortzland]

So, some of you think its ok to show our soldiers getting killed, and it's ok for CNN to show it to the world.

I, on the other hand, think it is dispicable.

In what reality is protesting the war "for the troops"? Help me here?

[Linkster]

I think that it is extremely important for everyone in the United States to see even more gruesome images than these - this is tame compared to what was on the TV news in the 60s during Vietnam
My claim for it being important is that it shows the real horror of war - the real killing that makes it real for people here at home - in no way am I against the troops - as a matter of fact quite the opposite - I know that war is not nice and perfectly packaged like some in the administration would have you believe - just as Johnson and Westmoreland tried to package it back then. War is horrible and my support for the troops goes way beyond just putting a little ribbon sticker on a car or a bumper sticker "supporting the troops" - Im supporting them by trying to keep as many alive as I can by protesting and hopefully shortening the length of time they serve overseas - the same way we did in Vietnam.
I also take time to actually support the families that the military wont help - those left back here - and for anyone who has been in the military while married and with children will tell you - support of families is left to the families themselves - and when I see them having to line up for handouts in food lines it tears me apart!!

Boortz - some of what I said was not meant to disparage you or your service whatsoever - Im sorry that you took it that way - I was merely trying to say that if you havent been there when something occured - please dont act like you have - it offends some that really were there. I commend you for your service and I hope that you made a difference while you were there - I like to think that I did - course all I got was a handful of medals and a quick boot after 12 years with an hon disch and a quick goodbye when I told them I wouldnt go for another 8 no matter what

[Abnormalia]

I think that it is extremely important for everyone in the United States to see even more gruesome images than these - this is tame compared to what was on the TV news in the 60s during Vietnam
My claim for it being important is that it shows the real horror of war - the real killing that makes it real for people here at home - in no way am I against the troops - as a matter of fact quite the opposite - I know that war is not nice and perfectly packaged like some in the administration would have you believe - just as Johnson and Westmoreland tried to package it back then. War is horrible and my support for the troops goes way beyond just putting a little ribbon sticker on a car or a bumper sticker "supporting the troops" - Im supporting them by trying to keep as many alive as I can by protesting and hopefully shortening the length of time they serve overseas - the same way we did in Vietnam.
I also take time to actually support the families that the military wont help - those left back here - and for anyone who has been in the military while married and with children will tell you - support of families is left to the families themselves - and when I see them having to line up for handouts in food lines it tears me apart!!

*ding ding ding* thread over.

[boortzland]

I also take time to actually support the families that the military wont help - those left back here - and for anyone who has been in the military while married and with children will tell you - support of families is left to the families themselves - and when I see them having to line up for handouts in food lines it tears me apart!!

Boortz - some of what I said was not meant to disparage you or your service whatsoever - Im sorry that you took it that way - I was merely trying to say that if you havent been there when something occured - please dont act like you have - it offends some that really were there. I commend you for your service and I hope that you made a difference while you were there - I like to think that I did - course all I got was a handful of medals and a quick boot after 12 years with an hon disch and a quick goodbye when I told them I wouldnt go for another 8 no matter what

While I appreciate your support of troops and families of troops, lets not forget the US military is all volunteer. And as former military you understand that as a member if the US military, we all have had our orders, like them or not, we followed them.

Listen, my whole point to starting this string, was that CNN showed no respect for the families and friends of these fallen soldiers. They have no loyalty to this country. I know as media, they are supposed to "give us the truth", but in today's split second media, the more greusome & horrifiying, the better. You know the old addige, If it "bleeds it leads".

I was merely trying to say that if you havent been there when something occured - please dont act like you have - it offends some that really were there.

As for me, and being there, I was intimately involved during the Iranan Hostage Crisis, and other activities during that time. Thats all the detail I'll discuss, but, like you, when I was discharged I got the cold shoulder big-time, and even some quite intimidating pressure. I had some specialized training, and they were none too happy that in their words, "I was bailing on them".
I feel no need to defend my service, nor to go on a public blog with details of actions I was involved in. I never "act".

[Bill]

But what about people like me who want to be able to see those videos?

I don't need to be babied, to be treated like I'm not mature enough to handle the truth.

This is supposed to be a free marketplace - that's the essence of a capitalist and democratic society.

In a free marketplace I should be able to get the information I want, in the form I want it.

What if I don't want to watch a tiny internet video, and am happy to see all the uncensored video I can get from the war?

As far as I'm concerned, CNN edited the video too much. I resent their censorship.

[Abnormalia]

Here here! I want to see gruesome videos! It's my God given right as an American to see videos of Americans getting killed! And Insurgents! And civilians! HELL YEAH! BLOOD!

[Moby]

So, some of you think its ok to show our soldiers getting killed, and it's ok for CNN to show it to the world.

I, on the other hand, think it is dispicable.

In what reality is protesting the war "for the troops"? Help me here?
I think people should have to see what they support. In my case I should have to see the good and bad parts of the war in Afghanistan. For those that support the war in Iraq they should have to see it and get real information about it.

It might be despicable but does that make it wrong? CCN, FOX News and just about everyone of our elected leaders and most of our appointed leaders live in the despicable every day.

CNN showing it on my TV just means that I have to press a button. When the No Spin zone calls college students Nazis because they're slamming Anne Coulter for calling a man a sex crazed oaf I press another button.

Outside of the fat drug addict that's too ugly for TV what's that big deal?

Who is worse, the talk show hosts that making money off the despicable or the news network making money off the despicable?

[Linkster]

The irony of all of this (and the good corporate decisions evidently) are that in their attempt to diss CNN for showing the video, the video has now been shown on every other news network including the ones that are making the biggest fuss over CNN showing it

[boortzland]

The irony of all of this (and the good corporate decisions evidently) are that in their attempt to diss CNN for showing the video, the video has now been shown on every other news network including the ones that are making the biggest fuss over CNN showing it

If thats the case, and I have not seen it but i'll look, then i feel the same way about them showing it. I really dont care who's doing it, it's not a good thing as far as I am concerned. Everybody "has the right" to watch what ever they want, but i guess their right to watch what they want, superceeds the right of the soldiers and their families to a little dignity.

[Moby]

If thats the case, and I have not seen it but i'll look, then i feel the same way about them showing it. I really dont care who's doing it, it's not a good thing as far as I am concerned. Everybody "has the right" to watch what ever they want, but i guess their right to watch what they want, superceeds the right of the soldiers and their families to a little dignity.
I find it interesting that Rush, Fox News and many of the far right will spend, days, weeks and even years digging into people's lives and putting them on trial yet they'll speak of dignity when it serves their own purposes. How pathetic to change values whenever it suits your need.

People being killed is part of war and anyone that supports war needs to see it. You've been involved with war so you're making an informed choice. Most Americans are not.

[Linkster]

Well - Ive got to assume that some here obviously have not actually seen the whole video - there is no scene showing anyone actually getting killed - the closest it comes is seeing an American soldier in a public square - then you hear a shot and the screen blacks out - while the translated talk talks about shooting the guy it is never even shown in the video - for all we know the shot could have been in the air and that was the effect that the "insurgency group" wanted

[Moby]

Linkster there's not reason to verify facts. If Rush or Neil says it's so then it must be so. Why let facts cloud your judgement? :)

[Tommy]

also I just thought about something

Is this war being fought by a volunteer army ???

if they are volunteer then they can go home any time they want
and clearly that's not the case

how many have been forced to stay past WAY past the end of their tours
how can you call that volunteer

[Abnormalia]

No, they 'voluntarily' sign up (bribes and lies, money and fame..etc...stupid scum-o-the-earth recruiters)

It's a contract that has worse-than-getting-fined consequences if you break it.

[Tommy]

but even still

i have heard all these stories about soldiers forced to stay beyond their tours of duty, surely those are all left wing lies and propaganda

cause if you force someone to stay then they aren't doing it voluntarily

[Abnormalia]

Well, we don't know what the document they signed says. "Being forced" might be slang for "unexpectedly longer service term". Sort of like "I was forced to stay out hunting longer because I hadn't shot anything yet". More of a figure of speech. Again, we don't know what they signed (at least I don't know).

[Linkster]

Tommy - basically when you go into the military you are under a different set of laws called the UCMJ (Uniform Code of Military Justice) - and basically what the military does when they need someone to stay overseas or rotate over there early is to draft an extension of duty which include the words "it is ordered" - and by the UCMJ failure to follow an order is a punishable offense.

When you "volunteer" there is a disclaimer that not only are you not guaranteed anything the recruiter told you - including what you will be doing as a job - and that you understand you are under the pervue of the UCMJ - although in reality, the military is pretty good about offerring incentive bonus's for people that volunteer to extend overseas

And the volunteer part - is just about joining the military - its not a draft (forced) - as soon as you are in you can be told to do just about anything as long as you are within your agreed upon time of enlistment - of course if you are being asked to stay beyond your enlistment time - then yes you can refuse that - Ive seen guys flown off of ships by a special plane just to avoid a lawsuit against the military

[boortzland]

I find it interesting that Rush, Fox News and many of the far right will spend, days, weeks and even years digging into people's lives and putting them on trial yet they'll speak of dignity when it serves their own purposes. How pathetic to change values whenever it suits your need.

People being killed is part of war and anyone that supports war needs to see it. You've been involved with war so you're making an informed choice. Most Americans are not.

When any media outlet investigates, comments and does stories on pulic figures, that is one thing. No one is changing values except those who would use this type of video for ratings, not to inform or educate.

Its funny how until the breakout of talk radio in the early 90's & the dawn of a TV station that would dare to give the opposing view, or right wing as your would call it, the liberal agenda dominated all of the media. There was no outlet for an opposing view. YOU keep bringing up Rush, and Fox news..are they a threat to you? If Rush is such a drug addict, and Fox is so right wing, why are you so threatened by them?

But, in this string we are talking about Joe Six-pack that joined the army, and then his mom has to sit in her un-airconditioned home, with nothing to eat, and with her rabbit ears on the TV (since she cant aford cable(another string)) she has to watch her son die right there on TV. Isn't that just great, explain to her why she had to see her son die, and why every time she turns on her TV for the next 20 years, there is a chance that some lib in New York wants to see her son die, and of coarse, it's his RIGHT!, SO like the 9/11 video's she will have to see it over and over.

So, should they should they show the 9/11 video's over and over, including the people falling from the World Trade Center? If you want folks to see troops dying, why not remind them why we can no longer wait to be attack before we act, by seeing those video's. Democrats and liberal media say that those video's are inflamitory. What's the difference?:disbelief:

[boortzland]

Tommy - basically when you go into the military you are under a different set of laws called the UCMJ (Uniform Code of Military Justice) - and basically what the military does when they need someone to stay overseas or rotate over there early is to draft an extension of duty which include the words "it is ordered" - and by the UCMJ failure to follow an order is a punishable offense.

When you "volunteer" there is a disclaimer that not only are you not guaranteed anything the recruiter told you - including what you will be doing as a job - and that you understand you are under the pervue of the UCMJ - although in reality, the military is pretty good about offerring incentive bonus's for people that volunteer to extend overseas

Most of us who were and are in The military understand "DUTY". You may be disappointed about staying, but that is your duty. Most of the people I speak to, and have spoken to in the past, understand that. Every group has its whiners. They usually start complaining before they are deployed.

[Linkster]

boortzland - agreed on the whiners - saw lots of those come and go

on the video - please get a copy and watch it - you obviously havent - as it DOES NOT show a soldier being killed - it intimates it but does not actually show anything - that is just the right wing spin thats been put on it.

I happened to be watching the military channel today and they had a good documentary on the vietnam war where they were showing real soldiers really being shot, blown up and maimed including two that were kneeling on the ground and shot in the head from behind and falling over dead as thier brains spilled out - and this was news footage from a network news channel back in the 1960s that really played on tv in the US - so please dont act like this is all of a sudden something out of the ordinary - the only part thats different is that the US has become so "offended" by every little damned thing that they wont actually show the killings - or caskets - or anything else that might be considered as offending mom - what a shame this country has become so lame it cant percieve reality - it has to be fed to it in survivor episodes

[stefan segal]

bootzerland...if bush is so sensitive to offending mom, then why hasn't he attended one funeral of the sons he killed...or for that matter, faced or talked to any of them enough to say he was sorry for their grief?

To hazard a guess...he didn't want to go on record as the responsible party?

Talk DUTY...let some "duty" start at the top where all the weasles hide.

Stefan

[boortzland]

bootzerland...if bush is so sensitive to offending mom, then why hasn't he attended one funeral of the sons he killed...or for that matter, faced or talked to any of them enough to say he was sorry for their grief?

To hazard a guess...he didn't want to go on record as the responsible party?

Talk DUTY...let some "duty" start at the top where all the weasles hide.

Stefan

Read between the lines. We know you hate Bush, so this will not influence you, but its worth posting to respond to your comment.

http://stripes.com/article.asp?section=104&article=37535&archive=true

[Linkster]

Convienient explanation - unfortunately it doesnt jive with past history:

"This is a departure from past presidents' practices. President Jimmy Carter attended ceremonies for troops killed in the failed hostage-rescue mission in Iran. President Ronald Reagan attended a service for Marines killed in Beirut. President Clinton went to Andrews Air Force Base to see the coffins of Americans killed in a terrorist attack in Nairobi in 1998."


Oh wait a minute - Heres the real reason:

"Bush's absence from funerals has kept them off the front pages, one of several administration policies that have minimized Americans' exposure to the costs of war. The Pentagon has cracked down on allowing photographs of flag-draped caskets as they arrive at military bases. And, late last year, the administration began enforcing restrictions that keep photographers and reporters some 50 yards from services."

From the Wash Post in 2005

[Moby]

So, should they should they show the 9/11 video's over and over, including the people falling from the World Trade Center? If you want folks to see troops dying, why not remind them why we can no longer wait to be attack before we act, by seeing those video's. Democrats and liberal media say that those video's are inflamitory. What's the difference?:disbelief:
Why are you discussing 9/11? We're talking about the war in Iraq. haven't you heard? They have nothing in common. Dubya has even stated that Saddam had nothing to do with 9/11.

You seem to keep confusing the two.

[stefan segal]

Boortzland...saying I hate bush is way too personal an emotion, reserved for those which have your respect as equals on the evolutionary scale.

The size of a man's character is measured by what moves him to anger...I do not hate shit, cockroaches or people exhibiting all the fascets of their low character in public and private...personally, I either do what I am able, to scrape bush off the public's collective shoe, and ignore what I can't.

I can't stand to see his moronic face, or hear his buttboy voice...always up to his elbows, like some demented corroner, pulling the heart and guts out of the body politic...always grinning his perverted piece of shit grin.

So if you are going to reverse engineer my emotions from this piece...I hope you will on this occaision, leap to DESPISE, while leaving the the more consequential emotions like hate, for those more worthy of it.

bush's true worth will become immediately apparent when he gets run over...(like his judge cousin just did, killing a cop with four kids)...on the way out the WH door.

The only emotion will be one of general and nationwide relief...like when they remove the tent from you house after poisoning an infestation of rats...relief.

Stefan

[stefan segal]

Linkster said:
I think that it is extremely important for everyone in the United States to see even more gruesome images than these - this is tame compared to what was on the TV news in the 60s during Vietnam
My claim for it being important is that it shows the real horror of war - the real killing that makes it real for people here at home - in no way am I against the troops - as a matter of fact quite the opposite
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I agree with him 100%...Everyone should know what they are sending their teenagers into...and what heros they actually are.

It is only through understanding that we can make the right choices.

If you watch these two vids, you will see how outrageously "our" government is short-changing these heros, by cutting their medical and VA care...and even having their wives and children standing in day-old bread lines, because they can't afford to live decently.

What sort of shit-heel is running our country?

Stefan


http://www.metacafe.com/watch/239815/snipers_vs_marines/


http://www.metacafe.com/watch/257539/u_s_marines_vs_chechyan_insurgents/

[Jesse Hemingway]

The F$KKKING dumb ass REPUBLICANS chose the IRAQ war it was the United States first trip down the road of preemptive WAR lead by the REPUBLICANS. It was a WAR of CHOICE it was a slam dunk, it should last 6 days 6 weeks not 6 months.

Oh I get it.

[boortzland]

Why are you discussing 9/11? We're talking about the war in Iraq. haven't you heard? They have nothing in common. Dubya has even stated that Saddam had nothing to do with 9/11.

You seem to keep confusing the two.

I didnt get them confused. It is simply relavant to THIS STRING. If the networks will show troops getting killed "so that we will know" the horror of where we are sending our troops, then they should show the graphic images of the horror that happened on 9/11, so that Americans will know why we can no longer take a passive position when it comes to terrorist and terrorist states.
But the liberal leftist media, will only show breif clips, because they know showing those videos, in their words "inflames the American people" , and would aid in the President's approval ratings concerning the war effort.

So you see they do have something in common. They are both video's that will inflame public opinion in favor or those evil warmongering republicans.