bible controversy

[black sheep commentary]

Friday, November 30, 2007
More Than One GOD?
I am basing this article on the King James Bible as well as my being raised lutheran. I am now a christian and learning more about ancient texts all the time. I believe in God, well actually I think ther are 3. No I do not want to hear 3 in 1 triune God. I think there are 3 separate entities. What I base this on comes from the book of Genisis. In the begining God created the heavens and the earth. OK good with that, now comes the zinger. On the creation of man God says let US create man in OUR image. He does not say let ME create man in MY image. hmmmm. what's up?
I think there is God the father (God of the old testament) and God the son (Jesus of the new testament) and the holy spirit ( a God of conscience trying to guide us to eternal life) Boy am I gonna hear it now. Think about it though. I think God the father demanded too much from mankind and God the son saw that humanity could not live up to the fathers strict rules and so chose to intervene in order to save the creation of mankind.
I belive this theory is well within the realm of possibility simply by thinking it through and the fact that the bible is very full of contradictions. The King James Bible was canonized or "put together" by men. Men are fallable. Even if it was the inspired word of God, what could be missing from other books or texts? Things you should know. Enoch who is mentioned in the bible was a very holy man and was taken up by God into heaven. Did you know he wrote the book of Enoch? Yet this book was ignored by the men assembling the bible. Also the apocolypse of James was almost put in the bible instead of revelation? Was there something in that book we should know?
Adam and Eve were created by God correct? They begot Cain and Able and Cain killed Able. Did you ever wonder where Cain found a wife as it says in the bible? If you read other texts you find God created Adam and Sarah from the dirt of the earth but she was too headstrong and so was banished from the garden of eden. Eve was then created from Adams rib. Move on to Noah. Did the tower of babel in which earth got its many languages from occur before or after Noah? If it occured before Noah and the earth was flooded and destroyed where did the languages come from? Adam and Eve populated the earth then bam! all gone in the flood save Noah and his family. Noah and his group re-populated the earth?
Man it is said is the only creature God created with a free will right? Well then how is it that Lucifer a created angel with no free will was able to CHOOSE to go against God as well as some of the other angels? God created angels to serve and obey him and yet some did not. Other angels looked upon the daughters of man and CHOSE ( free will?) to come down and have sex with them creating giants upon the earth. Right from the King James Bible. Incest was allowed in the old testament but not the new. There are an abundance of texts and books from ancient times that may contain information we need to know to guide us in this life. Ever get curious about that?
God did provide humans with gifts such as healing, casting out demons, etc. but watch out for these televangelists out there. Have you ever truly seen an angel or Satan or even God when you invoke help from them? They do not interfere in this life or all people would be rich with no worries right? How many have offered Satan their soul in return for wealth? Did they get it? How many have asked God for the same? Prosperity and healing preachers such as Rod Parsley, Benny Hinn, Bishop Jakes preach healing and freedom from bills. How many of you that sent in bills to be prayed over ever got relief from those or other bills?
Jesse Duplantis, John Hagee, Ken Copeland are all very eloquent speakers that can sway weak minds to believing them. Send us money and you will be blessed. My mother believed in some of them and died broke. Have you prospered sending these ministries money? Most all of these preachers have jets, Harley Davidson motorcycles, gold rings, fancy cars, huge homes, and more thanks to your contributions to the "Lord's work". do you? I do believe that John Hagee is at heart a good and honest preacher doing what he believes is right. Paul and Jan Crouch and their billion dollar TBN ministry seem to only want to elevate themselves. Look at the bible code they have discussed. They made an obvious effort to find themselves listed within this code in order I think to elevate themselves with great importance. How comfortable are all these people compared to you?
Do not count on the rapture!! No where does God say christians shall escape the tribulations to be visited upon man. The verse many preachers use to support rapture " In a twinkling of an eye those who are dead shall rise first to meet God then those who are alive shall also rise to meet the lord." means to me that when Christ returns at the end of time then these things shall come to pass. Do not be duped! There is much knowledge to be learned by studying for yourself. Oh and the Koran contains some of the same things as the King James Bible. Check it out. The book of Revelation and the end of the earth? That is for another time.

[hdmarketing]

Do not count on the rapture!! No where does God say christians shall escape the tribulations to be visited upon man.
I think you are wrong, try looking in Revelation 3:10 (New King James Version)
It says:
Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth.

Speaking of the tribuulation

The book of Revelation and the end of the earth? That is for another time.

The earth is not going to end.

Psalm 37:11
But the meek shall inherit the earth,And shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace.

Matthew 5:5
Blessed are the meek, For they shall inherit the earth.

[Yirmeyahu]

Do not count on the rapture!! No where does God say christians shall escape the tribulations to be visited upon man.

black sheep commentary is quite right.

That is not a reference to some kind of "rapture". It is a reference to what it says, the "trial", the judgment, after the resurrection, when all who are not found in the Book of Life will be "cast into the lake of fire".

Revelation 20:11-15

[hdmarketing]

black sheep commentary is quite right.

That is not a reference to some kind of "rapture". It is a reference to what it says, the "trial", the judgment, after the resurrection, when all who are not found in the Book of Life will be "cast into the lake of fire".

Revelation 20:11-15

His words were:
"No where does God say christians shall escape the tribulations to be visited upon man"

That is exactly what the scripture I posted is talking about. "The Tribulation of man".

[Yirmeyahu]

His words were:

Do not count on the rapture!! No where does God say christians shall escape the tribulations to be visited upon man.

He was talking about the rapture, and the tribulations he was speaking of are obviously those which occur prior to the final judgment of all mankind and don't refer to the final judgment itself.

[Jesse Hemingway]

That’s great bible study here too, lets look up the word hypocrite and find out what Jesus teaches about that word and how many times Jesus brings it up in his teachings? :lmao2: :lmao2: :lmao2:

Rapture or tribulations again all meaningless bull shit it won't matter if your a hypocrite that's do not pass go and do not collect 200 dollars!!!

[mwillman]

I hope the rapture does come I could do without all the christian tight asses trying to tell everyone how to live all the time.

[Betty Blowtorch]

Ahhhhhhhhhhh!!! http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/9734/screamingsv3.gif


Please, God!
Not another
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/3240/biblesmallbw1.gif http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/9139/thumperanimatedpi2.gif


It's enough to drive a person to...

http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/3423/dracula58dv0.jpg
ATHEISM.

[Jesse Hemingway]

Ahhhhhhhhhhh!!! http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/9734/screamingsv3.gif


Please, God!
Not another
http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/3240/biblesmallbw1.gif http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/9139/thumperanimatedpi2.gif


It's enough to drive a person to...

http://img524.imageshack.us/img524/3423/dracula58dv0.jpg
ATHEISM.

Where having you been Mrs.Blowtorch?

[Betty Blowtorch]

Where having you been Mrs.Blowtorch?
The nice doctors here at the Happy Hospital http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/1410/crazyjoerw9.gif
said I'm doing much better now that I'm taking
my 47 medications every day, and the voices
in my head have stopped telling me to murder
the other patients while they're sleeping.

The doctors gave me back my computer privileges
as long as I keep taking my meds and don't hurt
any more patients or staff.

I love it here. They're so nice to me. http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/6206/crazymanstraitjacketoi6.gif

[Jesse Hemingway]

The nice doctors here at the Happy Hospital http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/1410/crazyjoerw9.gif
said I'm doing much better now that I'm taking
my 47 medications every day, and the voices
in my head have stopped telling me to murder
the other patients while they're sleeping.

The doctors gave me back my computer privileges
as long as I keep taking my meds and don't hurt
any more patients or staff.

I love it here. They're so nice to me. http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/6206/crazymanstraitjacketoi6.gif

I think there are a couple of your associates or inmates from your outfit that post here now one goes by Radio Bitch, Fang, and hdmopjockey they talk that mindless carzy bull shit.

[LadyMod at scam.com]

I think you are wrong, try looking in Revelation 3:10 (New King James Version)
It says:
Because you have kept My command to persevere, I also will keep you from the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world, to test those who dwell on the earth.


Makes more sense to read the whole letter:


Revelation 3:

To the Church in Sardis

1 "To the angel[a] of the church in Sardis write:
These are the words of him who holds the seven spiritsof God and the seven stars. I know your deeds; you have a reputation of being alive, but you are dead.

2 Wake up! Strengthen what remains and is about to die, for I have not found your deeds complete in the sight of my God.

3 Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; obey it, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you.

4 Yet you have a few people in Sardis who have not soiled their clothes. They will walk with me, dressed in white, for they are worthy.

5 He who overcomes will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out his name from the book of life, but will acknowledge his name before my Father and his angels.

6 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.



[B]To the Church in Philadelphia

7 "To the angel of the church in Philadelphia write:
These are the words of him who is holy and true, who holds the key of David. What he opens no one can shut, and what he shuts no one can open.

8 I know your deeds. See, I have placed before you an open door that no one can shut. I know that you have little strength, yet you have kept my word and have not denied my name.

9 I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars—I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you.

10 Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on the earth.

11 I am coming soon. Hold on to what you have, so that no one will take your crown.

12 Him who overcomes I will make a pillar in the temple of my God. Never again will he leave it. I will write on him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem, which is coming down out of heaven from my God; and I will also write on him my new name.

13 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.


To the Church in Laodicea

14 "To the angel of the church in Laodicea write:
These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God's creation.

15 I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were either one or the other!

16 So, because you are lukewarm—neither hot nor cold—I am about to spit you out of my mouth.

17 You say, 'I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.' But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked.

18 I counsel you to buy from me gold refined in the fire, so you can become rich; and white clothes to wear, so you can cover your shameful nakedness; and salve to put on your eyes, so you can see.

19 Those whom I love I rebuke and discipline. So be earnest, and repent.

20 Here I am! I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in and eat with him, and he with me.

21 To him who overcomes, I will give the right to sit with me on my throne, just as I overcame and sat down with my Father on his throne.

22 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches."

[LadyMod at scam.com]

To the Church in Sardis




http://www.thelivingwordtbc.com/rev10.htm

If you or I had been evaluating these seven Churches, Sardis would probably have been the one with which we were the most impressed. This is the Church we probably would have wanted to move our membership. Yet, when the Lord wrote the Church at Smyrna, He did not have one bad thing to say about them. Yet, when He wrote the Church at Sardis, He did not have one good thing to say about them. The Church at Sardis reminds us that the things that so often impress us about Churches are the things that least impress the Lord. We are often more captivated by externals when God is more concerned with internals. We would have said the Church at Sardis was alive, but God said it was dead.

First, as we look at the Church at Sardis we see:


1. THE REPUTATION THAT WAS DECEIVING

The Lord usually began His letters by commending the Churches for the positives. But in the case of Sardis, since there was nothing good the Lord could say about them, He started by condemning the negatives. There were no positives to commend.

Jesus described how:

A. In Its Appearance The Church Was Lively

Jesus said, “Thou hast a name that thou livest” (Vs.1). From a human perspective this was a most impressive Church. I am sure that it never had a shortage of preachers that wanted to be pastor when its pulpit was vacant. It was no doubt considered a model Church in its day.

I can imagine that in its popularity it was second to none. It had a “name.” The Church was well known. If you had visited Sardis and asked for directions to the Church, anyone could have directed you. It was the Church that preachers and people discussed. It was known through-out the land.

I can imagine that in its personality it was second to none. Every Church has its own personality. Some are cold and some are warm. Some are compassionate and some are complacent. Some are exciting and some are boring. This Church had a personality that was impressive. It was no doubt the envy of all the Churches. All the Churches wanted to be like Sardis.

I can imagine that in its programs it was second to none. This Church had it going. This Church had something for the whole family. It no doubt had programs for its children, youth, singles, young adults, parents, senior citizens and any other group or need. Its music was probably the best one could hear. If a pastor's school had been held in those days, here was the place to have it.

I can imagine that in its possessions it was second to none. While many Churches struggled to get by, this Church had more than it needed. Its offerings were staggering to the mind and its building appealing to the eye. This was the big Church. This was the Church that everyone was saying was alive. This was the Church that was getting it done.

Jesus also described how:

B. In Its Assessment The Church Was Lifeless

We would give it two thumbs up, but God gave it two thumbs down. I’m sure everyone would have thought that if any of the Churches would receive a ravening letter from Jesus, it would be Sardis. But Jesus said plainly and very abruptly, “Thou art dead.” They had a label but no life. They had a reputation but no reality. They had a form but no force. Instead of being the Temple of the Living God, they were the morgue of the lifeless group. Vance Havner said that ministries go through four stages: a man, a movement, a machine, and a monument. The Church at Sardis was in the monument stage.



To the Church in Philadelphia



http://www.apocalipsis.org/t3-philadelphia.htm

Key phrase: I know that you have little strength, yet you have kept my word and have not denied my name

Philadelphia (modern day Alaþehir). Its name is derived from Attalus II (159-138 BC), whose truth and loyalty to his brother Eumenes won him the epithet Philadelphus (brotherly love). Being on a major trade route it had an open door for evangelism.


v10 - Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on the earth. - The hour of trial is mentioned in Dan 12:1, Mark 13:19 and it is likely that it is depicted by the seven trumpets and Ch 7-19 later in Revelation. The hour of trial is for the world not for the church which will be spiritually but not physically protected from it. The spiritual protection of the church is indicated in the sealing of the 144,000 (7:3), see also God's care of the woman in the desert (12:6, 14).

The best example of this is the fifth trumpet in which the locusts are specifically told only to harm those people who did not have the seal of God on their foreheads (9:4 cf. Isa 18:3). The term 'the inhabitants of the earth', which is similar to 'those who live on the earth' (see 11:10, 14:6) always refers to the world not to the church (Rev 6:10, 8:13, 11:10, 13:8, 13:14, 17:8). This promise is not just for the church at Philadelphia but for all who fulfil the requirement of the promise which is to endure patiently (see 1:9, 13:10, 14:12). Just as Satan tests the church in Smyrna through persecution (2:10), so God tests the world through trial or adversity. The meaning of the word 'keep' (Gk. tereo) is to guard, to watch over, so that the idea of this verse is preservation through the hour of trial.



To the Church in Laodicea


http://www.ourfatherlutheran.net/biblehomelands/sevenchurches/laodicea/laodictxt.htm

Laodicea
(A combination of the Greek laos (lah-os) and dike (dee'-kay), meaning "justice of the people;" modern Eskihisar,"old castle")



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Laodicea (or more properly "Laodikeia," pronounced lah-od-ik'-i-ah) was founded between 261 and 253 BC on an earlier site known as Diospolis by Antiochus II, one of the Seleucid kings who ruled Syria after the death of Alexander the Great. Antiochus named the city for his wife Laodice (whom he divorced in 240 BC). It was more accurately known as Laodicea ad Lyceum ("on-the-Lycus") to distinguish it from at least six other cities with the same name. The city subsequently became part of the kingdom of Pergamum (about 190 BC) and later (133 BC) became a Roman possession. Two important roads passed through the city, one from the ports of Ephesus and Miletus (about a 100 miles to the west) to Syria, and another from Pergamum south to the Mediterranean coast. It was one of three cities in the fertile Lycus River valley-- Colossae was 10 miles to the east, and Hierapolis, famous for its thermal baths, 6 miles to the north.

In 26 AD Laodicea was among several cities in Asia competing for the honor of erecting a temple to emperor Tiberius, but it lost out to Smyna. Only later, during the reigns of Commodus and Carcalla, was it granted the coveted title of "Temple-Warden."

The church in Laodicea was founded during Paul 's extended stay in Ephesus, probably by his companion Epaphras (Col. 2:12-13). In the 1st century AD the city had a large Jewish population which formed the nucleus of the early Christian community. Although Paul mentions the "brothers at Laodicea" in his letter to the Colossians (Colossians 4:15, 16), apparently he never visited them personally. Paul wrote a letter to the church at Laodicea but it was lost: "Our dear friend Luke, the doctor, and Demas send greetings. Give my greetings to the brothers at Laodicea, and to Nympha and the church in her house. After this letter has been read to you, see that it is also read in the church of the Laodiceans and that you in turn read the letter from Laodicea" (Col. 4: 14-16). Imagine a Bible study on the book of Laodiceans!

The church in Laodicea was the last of the Asian churches addressed by John in Revelation, and it has the unenviable distinction of being the only one about which he had nothing good to say. Of all the letters, it is the most biting and sarcastic:

The one drawback to Laodicea's location was its lack of a local water supply. It had neither the cool well water of nearby Colossae nor the healing, hot water springs of Hierapolis across the Lycus valley. Water had to be piped in via an aqueduct from the Baspinar Spring five miles to the south (now in the town of Denizli). By the time the water arrived it was tepid--neither hot nor cold. The city's lukewarm, mineral-laden water was suitable only as a means to induce vomiting ("spit you out," from Greek emeo, literally "to vomit, throw up). John's metaphor comparing the church to the city's lukewarm, stale tasting water would have been easily understood by the Christians of Laodicea. Their apathy and complacency made John sick to his stomach.

Laodicea was very pleasure-conscious, with a huge stadium and two lavish theaters. The city was noted throughout the Roman province of Asia for its wealth. As the banking center of province, it was the most prosperous of the seven cities. So wealthy were the citizens of Laodicea that when their city was destroyed by an earthquake in 60 AD, they refused the aid offered by Rome and rebuilt the city at their own expense. This rare example of self-sufficiency made the city famous. Because of their situation the statement, "I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing," is another pointed reference.

Laodicea also derived its wealth from the fertility of the surrounding countryside and its textile industry. It was famous for its black cloth manufactured from the glossy-black wool produced in the valley, said to be of a soft texture, almost like silk. The Laodiceans wore black garments with pride. But, in his letter John advised the Christians of the city to buy the "white clothes" of purity and righteousness.

Thirteen miles west of Laodicea, a celebrated school of medicine produced an eye salve made from alum called "Phrygian powder." It was said to cure weak eyes and was exported in tablet form throughout the Mediterranean. The Laodiceans took great pride in their medical skill, but they were unaware of their spiritual blindness. Jesus appeals to them to buy salve from him so they might have better spiritual vision.

Later history:

In the 4th century Laodicea emerged as the prominent Christian center of the region of Phrygia and was the site of an important Church council. It was also the capital of West Phrygia and was called the "Metropolis of Asia." Its prosperity continued into the fifth century, but it was devastated by an earthquake in 494 AD. The growth of Denizli nearby led to the immigration of the natives. Under Turkish rule it was named "Ladik," but it could not be revived. Gradually it lost its former prominence and was finally abandoned in the 13th century AD.

.
[/QUOTE]

[Jesse Hemingway]

Makes more sense to read the whole letter:


Revelation 3:

To the Church in Sardis

1 "To the angel[a] of the church in Sardis write:
These are the words of him who holds the seven spiritsof God and the seven stars. I know your deeds; you have a reputation of being alive, but you are dead.

2 Wake up! Strengthen what remains and is about to die, for I have not found your deeds complete in the sight of my God.

3 Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; obey it, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you.

4 Yet you have a few people in Sardis who have not soiled their clothes. They will walk with me, dressed in white, for they are worthy.

5 He who overcomes will, like them, be dressed in white. I will never blot out his name from the book of life, but will acknowledge his name before my Father and his angels.

6 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.



[B]To the Church in Philadelphia

7 "To the angel of the church in Philadelphia write:
These are the words of him who is holy and true, who holds the key of David. What he opens no one can shut, and what he shuts no one can open.

8 I know your deeds. See, I have placed before you an open door that no one can shut. I know that you have little strength, yet you have kept my word and have not denied my name.

9 I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars—I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you.

10 Since you have kept my command to endure patiently, I will also keep you from the hour of trial that is going to come upon the whole world to test those who live on the earth.

11 I am coming soon. Hold on to what you have, so that no one will take your crown.

12 Him who overcomes I will make a pillar in the temple of my God. Never again will he leave it. I will write on him the name of my God and the name of the city of my God, the new Jerusalem, which is coming down out of heaven from my God; and I will also write on him my new name.

13 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.


To the Church in Laodicea

14 "To the angel of the church in Laodicea write:
These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God's creation.

15 I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were either one or the other!

16 So, because you are lukewarm—neither hot nor cold—I am about to spit you out of my mouth.

17 You say, 'I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.' But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked.

18 I counsel you to buy from me gold refined in the fire, so you can become rich; and white clothes to wear, so you can cover your shameful nakedness; and salve to put on your eyes, so you can see.

19 Those whom I love I rebuke and discipline. So be earnest, and repent.

20 Here I am! I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in and eat with him, and he with me.

21 To him who overcomes, I will give the right to sit with me on my throne, just as I overcame and sat down with my Father on his throne.

22 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches."


It makes total sense to read the whole letter after you have been in the same situation as the person that wrote it, they say john wrote it on some island while he was in exile he was sent to that island because he was considered a terrorist of his time. I would imagine that into today’s terms it would be similar to being sent to Guantanamo Bay; WOW so all the Christians today are worshiping the terrorists of yesteryear.
Now the book of revelations makes total sense it would be like reading an encrypted message from a terrorist held a Guantanamo Bay to angel a person or position within an Al-Qaeda cell. So now, the critical question becomes who and how do you crack the encrypted message. That’s right you leave in the hands of the terrorist of that time for 300 plus years. Then you transfrer it to one of the most corrupt organizations of all recorded history for about another 900 years.:lmao2: :lmao2: :lmao2:

Then some of you jerks on this site ridicule anyone that says that the Government has not answered all the questions about 9/11. WTF and you have the bravado pass this crap the bible off as fact but you can not even honestly answers what happened six years ago. Spare me the bull shit please.