PDA

View Full Version : Debt Free America Act



Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 09:54 AM
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?c111:1:./temp/~c111zEb2CR:e1126:


SEC. 2. FINDINGS; PURPOSES.

(a) Findings- The Congress finds the following:

(1) The current tax structure creates economic distortions that limit growth and job creation.

(2) The estimated cost of compliance to taxpayers is five billion hours and approximately $200 billion.

(3) Restructuring the tax code will promote economic prosperity.

(4) Replacing existing Federal taxes with a fee on transactions eliminates systemic inefficiency that plagues the current tax code.

(5) The United States, from its beginning in 1790 to the present, has been free of a national debt for only two years, 1834 and 1835.

(6) The national debt has grown from $75.5 million in 1790 to $5.8 trillion in 2008.

(7) Expressed as a percentage of gross domestic product (GDP), the national debt reached a high of 108.6 percent of GDP in 1946.

(8) After 1946, the national debt as a percentage of GDP declined, reaching a low of 32.5 percent in 1981.

(9) The large budget deficits of the 1980s and 1990s reversed this trend and pushed the percentage to another high of 49.5 percent in 1993.

(10) The Federal budget surpluses from fiscal year 1998 to fiscal year 2001 were used to retire a portion of the publicly held national debt.

(11) Between fiscal year 1997 and fiscal year 2001, the publicly held portion of the national debt declined by more than $400 billion.

(12) Since fiscal year 2002, a return to budget deficits has caused the debt to grow again.

(b) Purposes- The purpose of section 3 of this Act is to establish a fee on most transactions. Such fee--

(1) is different than a sales tax in that a sales tax is charged only on sales to the final consumer and the transaction fee would apply to intermediate users as well as end users,

(2) is different than a value added tax (VAT), commonly used in European and other countries, in that a VAT is imposed only on a portion of a transaction's value (roughly the difference between an item's selling price and it's cost) and the transaction fee would apply to the entire amount of the transaction, and

(3) is intended to raise sufficient revenue to eliminate the national debt, which was $10.6 trillion in January 2009, during a period of 7 years and to phase out the income tax on individuals.

SEC. 3. IMPLEMENTATION OF A TRANSACTION FEE.

(a) In General- Subtitle D of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 is amended by inserting after chapter 36 the following new chapter:

`CHAPTER 37--TRANSACTION FEE

`Sec. 4501. Imposition of transaction fee.

`SEC. 4501. IMPOSITION OF TRANSACTION FEE.

`(a) In General- There is hereby imposed on every specified transaction a fee in an amount equal to 1 percent of the amount of such transaction.

`(b) Specified Transaction- For purposes of this chapter--

`(1) IN GENERAL- The term `specified transaction' means any transaction that uses a payment instrument, including any check, cash, credit card, transfer of stock, bonds, or other financial instrument.

`(2) TRANSACTION- The term `transaction' includes retail and wholesale sales, purchases of intermediate goods, and financial and intangible transactions.

`(c) Liability for Fee- Persons become liable for the fee at the moment the person exercises control over a piece of property or service, regardless of the payment method.

`(d) Collection- The fees will be collected by the seller or financial institution servicing the transaction and shall be paid over to the Secretary. In the case of a person who fails to collect and pay over the fee as required under this subsection, such person shall become liable for the fee not so collected and paid over.

`(e) Potential Exclusions- Subsection (a) shall not apply to transactions involving stock (and any options or derivatives with respect to stock) until--

`(1) such time as the United States enters into an international agreement that regulates domestic and international stock exchanges, or

`(2) the Secretary issues recommendations regarding the application of the fee as it applies to stock.

`(f) Regulations- The Secretary shall issue such regulations or other guidance as may be necessary or appropriate to carry out the purposes of this section, including regulations or other guidance which require reporting of such information as the Secretary determines appropriate to prevent under reporting of the amounts on which a fee is imposed by this section.'.

(b) Clerical Amendment- The table of chapters for the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 is amended by inserting after the item relating to section 36 the following new item:

`Chapter 37. Transaction Fee.'.

(c) Effective Date- The amendments made by this section shall apply to transactions in calendar years beginning after the date of the enactment of this Act.

SEC. 4. INCOME TAX CREDIT DURING PERIOD THAT TRANSACTION FEE AND INDIVIDUAL INCOME TAX ARE IN EFFECT.

(a) In General- Subpart A of part IV of subchapter A of chapter 1 of the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 is amended by inserting after section 25D the following new section:

`SEC. 25E. CREDIT DURING PERIOD OF TRANSACTION FEE AND INDIVIDUAL INCOME TAX.

`(a) In General- In the case of an individual, there shall be allowed as a credit against the tax imposed by this chapter for the taxable year an amount equal to 1 percent of the taxpayer's adjusted gross income.

`(b) Phaseout Based on Adjusted Gross Income- The credit allowed under subsection (a) for any taxable year shall be reduced (but not below zero) by an amount which bears the same ratio to the amount of such credit (determined without regard to this subsection) as--

`(1) the excess (if any) of the taxpayer's adjusted gross income for such taxable year over $100,000 ($250,000 in the case of a joint return), bears to

`(2) $10,000 ($20,000 in the case of a joint return).'.

(b) Clerical Amendment- The table of sections for subpart A of part IV of subchapter A of chapter 1 of such Code is amended by inserting after the item relating to section 25D the following new item:

`Sec. 25E. Credit during period of transaction fee and individual income tax.'.

(c) Effective Date- The amendments made by this section shall apply to taxable years beginning during calendar years beginning after the date of the enactment of this Act.

SEC. 5. ESTABLISHMENT OF TASK FORCE.

(a) In General- Title III of the Congressional Budget Act of 1974 (2 U.S.C. 631 et seq.) is amended by adding at the end the following new section:

While democrats are busy doing....what is it the democratic party is doing....the republicans are busy tackling the needs of this nation to restructure its tax codes.

Any problems with this?

cottonbroker1
09-10-2011, 10:30 AM
Yes SEC. 4501 (e) is too vague...until what on those transactions I wonder? Sounds like someone is trying to slip one over on us under the radar..the dirty rats...speaking of dirty rats now that you are a Repub you can never flip back to being a democrat!! We LOATHE traitors to the proud Repub party...welcome to the club and just like a damn goose you have basically mated for life or you will be ex-communicated, slandered and harassed by members and repub goon squads if you try to leave the party...oh, and have a nice day...!!!! BTW, traditionally Repubs are huge on manners. Especially this Repub and for sure in the south so always say thanks, your welcome and good morning even to your most hated enemies (unless they are former members of the party and then they simply do not exist)

cottonbroker1
09-10-2011, 10:49 AM
BTW....dont forget that Repubs are highly patriotic and we also loathe any enemy of America be it foreign or domestic. We love this country almost as much as we love ourselves and anyone who doesnt and is not a complete patriot is nothing but stinking trash to us....

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 11:21 AM
This will eliminate the taxes paid by income taxes and a lot of corporate taxes still not addressed.

As it will not increase the amount of revenue, however, it will necessitate the downsizing more of our government. Should we privatize institutions, and find out there is a need for higher taxes, that can be addressed in the future.

For now, this works best in the global economy.

2T
09-10-2011, 11:28 AM
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/F?c111:1:./temp/~c111zEb2CR:e1126:



While democrats are busy doing....what is it the democratic party is doing....the republicans are busy tackling the needs of this nation to restructure its tax codes.

Any problems with this?

so when you said you would be a republican, did it mean you would have to shed some IQ??? :lmao2:

your "debt free America act" is by one
Rep Fattah, Chaka [PA-2] (introduced 3/16/2011) Cosponsors (None)

oh look at that no co sponsors... an unsupported piece of legislation,





Latest Major Action: 3/16/2011 Referred to House committee. Status: Referred to the Committee on Ways and Means, and in addition to the Committees on the Budget, Rules, and Appropriations, for a period to be subsequently determined by the Speaker, in each case for consideration of such provisions as fall within the jurisdiction of the committee concerned.



buried in committee by the speaker







but one more problem Cookie Parker, R




Rep. Chaka Fattah (D-PA 2nd District)
9th term Democrat from Pennsylvania 2nd District.

cottonbroker1
09-10-2011, 11:29 AM
This will eliminate the taxes paid by income taxes and a lot of corporate taxes still not addressed.

As it will not increase the amount of revenue, however, it will necessitate the downsizing more of our government. Should we privatize institutions, and find out there is a need for higher taxes, that can be addressed in the future.

For now, this works best in the global economy.
and a lot of corporate taxes still not addressed? ummmm the democrat in you is still showing. We repubs are too savvy to fall for the old dem playground trick of you show me yours and I'll show you mine but you go first....it takes analytical thinking, brains, common sense and being about three steps ahead of the enemy at all times to be anything more than a wanna be in this party..we dont screw around and we take no prisoners...(write that part down for later reference!)

Big Dog
09-10-2011, 11:31 AM
It has to be a replacement tax. I would require the abolishment of the income tax be included, and the rate of the consumption tax be raised to 15 or 17%.

And no tax on used second hand goods in order to promote recycling and fight planned obsolescence.

For corporations, zero taxes and zero subsidies, which would dis-empower Corporate lobbyists.


.

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 11:32 AM
so when you said you would be a republican, did it mean you would have to shed some IQ??? :lmao2:

your "debt free America act" is by one

oh look at that no co sponsors... an unsupported piece of legislation,
buried in committee by the speaker

but one more problem Cookie Parker, R

So. Let's see so far. I have had one republican on this thread engage in the topic, one "indpendent" refuse to, and one democrat throw slams.

What can we see about this? That basically, Americans are kept at each others' throats, divided along "party" lines, and NOT dealing with what the men behind the curtain are doing.

See how easy it is for the rich to get one over on us? We're too busy ignoring the issues. Ignoring the reality of our parties and just "watching" the news and slamming each other about it.

I'll continue to show what's going on. Do I have hope that anyone will actually engage in the issues? Not at this point.

And being a republican is not hard. Just drop the phoney religious "social" conservative distractions the rich have focused on and look at the hard core globalization the republicans are pushing.

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 11:32 AM
It has to be a replacement tax. I would require the abolishment of the income tax be included, and the rate of the consumption tax be raised to 15 or 17%.

And no tax on used second hand goods in order to promote recycling and fight planned obsolescence.


.


Those are YOUR wishes. But you're not in Congress. What is being proposed in all actuality. Can you find it?

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 11:34 AM
and a lot of corporate taxes still not addressed? ummmm the democrat in you is still showing. We repubs are too savvy to fall for the old dem playground trick of you show me yours and I'll show you mine but you go first....it takes analytical thinking, brains, common sense and being about three steps ahead of the enemy at all times to be anything more than a wanna be in this party..we dont screw around and we take no prisoners...(write that part down for later reference!)


Do you agree that corporations are paying too much in taxes to invest in the high costs in the US?

You seem focused on the words taxes and corporations from a democratic side. I think the elimination of corporate taxes helps the globalization of the world and the price of gas here.

2T
09-10-2011, 11:38 AM
So. Let's see so far. I have had one republican on this thread engage in the topic, one "indpendent" refuse to, and one democrat throw slams.

What can we see about this? That basically, Americans are kept at each others' throats, divided along "party" lines, and NOT dealing with what the men behind the curtain are doing.

See how easy it is for the rich to get one over on us? We're too busy ignoring the issues. Ignoring the reality of our parties and just "watching" the news and slamming each other about it.

I'll continue to show what's going on. Do I have hope that anyone will actually engage in the issues? Not at this point.

And being a republican is not hard. Just drop the phoney religious "social" conservative distractions the rich have focused on and look at the hard core globalization the republicans are pushing.

actually babes, its one independant followed your link and read the material.. (well 1st I discovered that your link had expired so I had to search Thomas again) then I saw that only one person was "busy" as you claim republicans in plural. While the Replublicans had actually buried this in committee since March, 6 months agon... not alot of Rs getting busy there ;) Then just to be thorough in my understanding of your claim I found a bio on Mr Fattah and that is where I saw the D.

so it nullifies your arguement... I know you are wanting to cry foul and calim I slammed you but your point is moot

the men behind the curtain killed this proposed act on the day it was submitted

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 11:39 AM
actually babes, it one independant followed your link and read the material.. (well 1st I discovered that your link had expired so I had to search Thomas again) then I saw that only one person was "busy" as you claim republicans in plural. While the Replublicans had actually buried this in committee since March, 6 months agon... not alot of Rs getting busy there ;) Then just to be thorough in my understanding of your claim I found a bio on Mr Fattah and that is where I saw the D.

so it nullifies your arguement... I know you are wanting to cry foul and calim I slammed you but your point is moot


YOu are in total belief that there are NO democrats in Congress who support globalization? Do you think Hillary would have been an isolationist?

What about the taxation do you find confusing for a democrat to make? Or do you think all democrats are for getting rid of the income tax and replacing it with other taxes?

2T
09-10-2011, 11:40 AM
YOu are in total belief that there are NO democrats in Congress who support globalization? Do you think Hillary would have been an isolationist?

What about the taxation do you find confusing for a democrat to make? Or do you think all democrats are for getting rid of the income tax and replacing it with other taxes?

now you are just playing ignorant

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 11:44 AM
actually babes, its one independant followed your link and read the material.. (well 1st I discovered that your link had expired so I had to search Thomas again) then I saw that only one person was "busy" as you claim republicans in plural. While the Replublicans had actually buried this in committee since March, 6 months agon... not alot of Rs getting busy there ;) Then just to be thorough in my understanding of your claim I found a bio on Mr Fattah and that is where I saw the D.

so it nullifies your arguement... I know you are wanting to cry foul and calim I slammed you but your point is moot

the men behind the curtain killed this proposed act on the day it was submitted


Sorry that it timed out. Had no idea it did that.

Here it is in a nutshell.

http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h4646/show


H.R.4646 - Debt Free America Act

To establish a fee on transactions which would eliminate the national debt and replace the income tax on individuals. view all titles (2)
OpenCongress Summary
This bill seeks to eliminate the national debt by repealing the individual income tax and adding a new 1% tax on all financial transactions, including all consumer transactions like uses of cash, check and debit. It would also repeal refundable and nonrefundable personal tax credits and the alternative minimum tax (AMT). This bill has not attracted any co-sponsors, moved in the legislative process, or gotten any attention from congressional leaders. There is virtually zero chance of it moving in Congress. For more information, see this OpenCongress blog post: Vast Majority of Bills Go Nowhere (Debt Free America Edition).
Official Summary
2/23/2010--Introduced.Debt Free America Act - States as purposes of this Act the raising of sufficient revenue from a fee on transactions to eliminate the national debt within seven years and the phasing out of the individual income tax. Amends the Internal Revenue Code to impose a 1% fee,...Read the Rest

Being in committee is a forward step for passage. If it were not given to a committee, it would die.

cottonbroker1
09-10-2011, 11:44 AM
2t's message is hidden cuz she just made my ignore list in the chamber of commerce thread...:thumbsup: :hi:

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 11:45 AM
now you are just playing ignorant


And you are just not going to engage in discussions. I get it. It's intimidating to actually SEE what is going on and discuss the merits or not than it is to SLAM other people for perceived actions by our government.

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 11:47 AM
2t's message is hidden cuz she just made my ignore list in the chamber of commerce thread...:thumbsup: :hi:


Not surprising. When republicans are faced with the reality that their party supports the whole globalization over the America which includes foreign nations, they can't handle it.

It's far better to continue the discussions of the lies from FOX news.

Either you support the republican agenda, or not. But your denial of its existence does not stop it from being true. You are voting to downgrade the standard of living in the US in order to get globalization here.

Big Dog
09-10-2011, 11:47 AM
Those are YOUR wishes. But you're not in Congress. What is being proposed in all actuality. Can you find it?

Not having a legal background, it appears to be a 1% transaction fee.

And yes, those are ideas that I like. Not necessarily my wishes as I am open to listen to arguments against them that could change my mind.


.

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 11:49 AM
Not having a legal background, it appears to be a 1% transaction fee.

And yes, those are my ideas. Not necessarily my wishes as I am open to listen to arguments against them that could change my mind.


.

Good luck. The democrats don't seem to have any issues with removing the income taxes and replacing it with a 1% transaction fee.

Big Dog
09-10-2011, 11:51 AM
Globalization? ... nah, we need to be globally competitive.


.

cottonbroker1
09-10-2011, 11:53 AM
im being cautious with you now that ur a Repub cookie...that means you have became a very savvy player of the games that run this country, provide jobs and take care of those less fortunate....I will approach you but i approach you with caution because now i know you mean real business about saving this country and you are not just slinging bullshit like obama and co. do....we are on the same team now so no reason for infighting. We have two common goals now. #1. save this country from the evils of obama and his brand of hatred and class warfare. he has divided this country and he has damn near wrecked us financially beyond the point of no return...#2..see #1.

2T
09-10-2011, 11:53 AM
And you are just not going to engage in discussions. I get it. It's intimidating to actually SEE what is going on and discuss the merits or not than it is to SLAM other people for perceived actions by our government.

what merit are you trying to point out? that a dem proposed a tax bill, has no co sponsors and that you are niave enough to think an unsupported bill by a minority member of the house will ever be heard from again. Clearly you have never paid attention to proposed leg and how it dies... you can keep trying the "slam" claim but it doesn't wash...

explain your 1st post,,, claiming that the Rs are getting busy, what Rs were you taking about?

Big Dog
09-10-2011, 11:53 AM
Good luck. The democrats don't seem to have any issues with removing the income taxes and replacing it with a 1% transaction fee.

IMO, I haven't crunched the numbers, but a 1% transaction fee won't provide enough dollars to run the gov't, much less reduce the debt.

Do you have the numbers?


.

2T
09-10-2011, 11:56 AM
Sorry that it timed out. Had no idea it did that.

Here it is in a nutshell.

http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h4646/show



Being in committee is a forward step for passage. If it were not given to a committee, it would die.

no, its not. Bills with no co sponsors go to committee to die

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 12:08 PM
what merit are you trying to point out? that a dem proposed a tax bill, has no co sponsors and that you are niave enough to think an unsupported bill by a minority member of the house will ever be heard from again. Clearly you have never paid attention to proposed leg and how it dies... you can keep trying the "slam" claim but it doesn't wash...

explain your 1st post,,, claiming that the Rs are getting busy, what Rs were you taking about?


What part of getting rid of income tax do you not understand?

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 12:09 PM
no, its not. Bills with no co sponsors go to committee to die


Really? I'd love to see your stats on that.

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 12:10 PM
IMO, I haven't crunched the numbers, but a 1% transaction fee won't provide enough dollars to run the gov't, much less reduce the debt.

Do you have the numbers?


.


No. But my guess is, once the income tax is removed, a new tax, such as the flat tax or fair tax. can be introduced to generate revenue. Until that time, having less income forces the government to make the reductions in programs it needs to do.

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 12:12 PM
im being cautious with you now that ur a Repub cookie...that means you have became a very savvy player of the games that run this country, provide jobs and take care of those less fortunate....I will approach you but i approach you with caution because now i know you mean real business about saving this country and you are not just slinging bullshit like obama and co. do....we are on the same team now so no reason for infighting. We have two common goals now. #1. save this country from the evils of obama and his brand of hatred and class warfare. he has divided this country and he has damn near wrecked us financially beyond the point of no return...#2..see #1.


Bringing in the emotionalism is not a characteristic most republicans adopt. they are quietly working to move forward the globalization agenda and getting America to be part of the worker market out there.

Emotionalism is not a discussion point, but rather a slam point. Until both parties are presented in their true light, without the emotionalism, then there are no winners in this nation but the upper 1% working diligently on their agenda.

2T
09-10-2011, 12:14 PM
What part of getting rid of income tax do you not understand?


I understand that you equated this to a political party here



While democrats are busy doing....what is it the democratic party is doing....the republicans are busy tackling the needs of this nation to restructure its tax codes.

Any problems with this?

what was you point?

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 12:16 PM
I understand that you equated this to a political party here



what was you point?


That it made a republican committee...three of them.

And in committee it is discussed.

You have not proven that that is wrong.

Why is it you won't discuss the issues? Are you an emotional democrat who just knee jerk hates the right? Gee.....seems SSDD here on the left side of the aisle.

Big Dog
09-10-2011, 12:18 PM
No. But my guess is, once the income tax is removed, a new tax, such as the flat tax or fair tax. can be introduced to generate revenue. Until that time, having less income forces the government to make the reductions in programs it needs to do.

I agree with that.

The bill referenced phasing out the income tax. IMO, it has to be all or nothing ... a replacement, no "phasing". Why? ... because I don't trust our pols.


.

2T
09-10-2011, 12:28 PM
That it made a republican committee...three of them.

And in committee it is discussed.

You have not proven that that is wrong.

Why is it you won't discuss the issues? Are you an emotional democrat who just knee jerk hates the right? Gee.....seems SSDD here on the left side of the aisle.

you are wrong


Step 2: Assignment to Committee
Once the bill is introduced into the House or the Senate, it is then assigned to an appropriate committee in that chamber. Within the committee process, it is assigned to a subcommittee for specific consideration. If the subcommittee discusses and approves it, the bill goes on to be discussed by the full committee. If the subcommittee either does not discuss the bill or discusses the bill and decides against it (or "kills" it), the bill "dies" in subcommittee and is never even discussed by the full committee, let alone the full Congress. If the full committee discussed the bill and approves it, it then may be ready to be placed on the agenda for discussion by the full chamber.

However, if the full committee never takes up the bill or if it disapproves of the bill, the bill will "die" in committee and never have a chance to be discussed by the full House or the full Senate. This is an important point. The fact is that 90 percent of the legislation introduced into either the House or Senate never makes it beyond the committee process

http://www.polisci.ccsu.edu/trieb/Cong-2.html

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 12:28 PM
I agree with that.

The bill referenced phasing out the income tax. IMO, it has to be all or nothing ... a replacement, no "phasing". Why? ... because I don't trust our pols.


.


The shock to the economy would be too great, IMHO. Gradually, cutting more and more with less, would allow Americans to see they don't need to depend on government institutions, but that they could do without a lot of waste and with that, reduce their taxes to nothing.

Big Dog
09-10-2011, 12:29 PM
According to Buffet, the real wealth resides in the top .3%, not 1%.

Half of America doesn't pay taxes, so they have no skin in the game. And, IIRC, the top 9% pays 70% of taxes.

The founding fathers limited voting rights to property owners because those were the people with skin in the game, willing to invest and risk their wealth.

.


.

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 12:30 PM
you are wrong



http://www.polisci.ccsu.edu/trieb/Cong-2.html


You've proven nothing.

From your own sources, you must prove the bill is not being discussed.

It was ONE democrat who proposed a bill that went the 3 Republcian committees.

Show me it is NOT being discussed.

2T
09-10-2011, 12:30 PM
Step 2: Committee Consideration
All bills and resolutions are "referred" to one or more House or Senate committees according their specific rules.

Standing Rules of the US Senate
Rules of the US House of Representatives

Step 3: Committee Action
The committee considers the bill in detail. For example, the powerful House Ways and Means Committee and Senate Appropriations Committee will consider a bill's potential impact on the Federal Budget.

If the committee approves the bill, it moves on in the legislative process. Committees reject bills by simply not acting on them. Bills that fail to get committee action are said to have "died in committee," as many do.



http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/uscongress/a/legprocess.htm

2T
09-10-2011, 12:31 PM
You've proven nothing.

From your own sources, you must prove the bill is not being discussed.

It was ONE democrat who proposed a bill that went the 3 Republcian committees.

Show me it is NOT being discussed.

I thought you were going to play this smart,,,, I had hoped you weren't going to make a joke out of conservatives. I was wrong

2T
09-10-2011, 12:32 PM
You've proven nothing.

From your own sources, you must prove the bill is not being discussed.

It was ONE democrat who proposed a bill that went the 3 Republcian committees.

Show me it is NOT being discussed.

simple, there is no action reported

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 12:32 PM
According to Buffet, the real wealth resides in the top .3%, not 1%.

Half of America doesn't pay taxes, so they have no skin in the game. And, IIRC, the top 9% pays 70% of taxes.

The founding fathers limited voting rights to property owners because those were the people with skin in the game, willing to invest and risk their wealth.

.


.


In all due fairness to the honesty of the topic, those not paying income taxes ARE paying income taxes each week. They just don't make enough to have to pay MORE income taxes at the end of the year.

In addition, the upper 1% increased their income 281% with laws from the Congress from 1979 to present.

The investment and risk is no longer applicable since free markets can rely on the tax dollars of the government to bail them out.

That being said, removing voting rights from people to back at the federalist level of property ownership removes this constitution as a living breathing document. That does not need to be done.

We need to accept globalization, lower the wages, work toward getting foreign manufacturing here and get by with less government.

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 12:33 PM
simple, there is no action reported


Proof. Show me the lack of action from each of the 3 committees.

cottonbroker1
09-10-2011, 12:34 PM
The shock to the economy would be too great, IMHO. Gradually, cutting more and more with less, would allow Americans to see they don't need to depend on government institutions, but that they could do without a lot of waste and with that, reduce their taxes to nothing.you are damn right we dont need any big govt. stinking institutions...hell coo coo parker, you might just make a good Repub after all...good work! :thumbsup:

Big Dog
09-10-2011, 12:34 PM
The shock to the economy would be too great, IMHO. Gradually, cutting more and more with less, would allow Americans to see they don't need to depend on government institutions, but that they could do without a lot of waste and with that, reduce their taxes to nothing.

I see it as a foot in the door to set precedent and establish a new tax. That's why I would insist on the abolishment of the income tax in the same bill.

Wasn't the income tax wedged in, back in 1901 or 3 by promising it would only be 1%? ... that's where I'm going with this.

There should be no shock, if the amount of revenue from income tax is equal to that generated by a 1% transaction fee.

The only shock will be to the accountants, lawyers, and lobbyists it puts out of work, IMO.
.

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 12:34 PM
I thought you were going to play this smart,,,, I had hoped you weren't going to make a joke out of conservatives. I was wrong


Again, a republican rebuttal. You can't provide proof of what you are saying and you demand republicans to do so?

It's your assertion. Your opinion. Prove it right, or it's just more propaganda to have an emotional argument, not an intellectual one.

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 12:35 PM
I see it as a foot in the door to set precedent and establish a new tax.

Wasn't the income tax wedged in, back in 1901 or 3 by promising it would only be 1%? ... that's where I'm going with this.

There should be no shock, if the amount of revenue from income tax is equal to that generated by a 1% transaction fee.

The only shock will be to the accountants, lawyers, and lobbyists it puts out of work, IMO.
.


I can agree with that. But I believe psychologically, removing it bit by bit is the best way to avoid an all out revolution.

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 12:37 PM
you are damn right we dont need any big govt. stinking institutions...hell coo coo parker, you might just make a good Repub after all...good work! :thumbsup:


This is your party exposed. Ask Irene victims how they feel about using bake sales to repair their homes instead of low to no interest loans.

I'll not partake in your emotionalism. The fact you can't contribute anything but emotionalism to the argument proves you know less about your party than I do.

2T
09-10-2011, 12:40 PM
Sorry that it timed out. Had no idea it did that.

Here it is in a nutshell.

http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-h4646/show



Being in committee is a forward step for passage. If it were not given to a committee, it would die.

wrong bill btw, the one you started this thread with was introduced in 3,2011
try reading your own information.

maybe Mr Fattah introduced this bill last yr too and OOOOOHHH it died in committee

Big Dog
09-10-2011, 12:41 PM
I can agree with that. But I believe psychologically, removing it bit by bit is the best way to avoid an all out revolution.

I think that psychologically, it would be an upper, not a downer. I guess that's something we're going to disagree on.

IMO, it's just too dangerous to permit both to exist simultaneously. Congress et al. will twist it. I don't trust them as much as you do.


.

2T
09-10-2011, 12:42 PM
Again, a republican rebuttal. You can't provide proof of what you are saying and you demand republicans to do so?

It's your assertion. Your opinion. Prove it right, or it's just more propaganda to have an emotional argument, not an intellectual one.

its proven, 6 months with no action, no subcommittee referrals, no additional co sponsors ..

Big Dog
09-10-2011, 12:44 PM
Re: Irene

If you're going to live in a flood plain, buy insurance. Don't ask the rest of America to subsidize your ocean view or waterfront property.


.

cottonbroker1
09-10-2011, 12:52 PM
This is your party exposed. Ask Irene victims how they feel about using bake sales to repair their homes instead of low to no interest loans.

I'll not partake in your emotionalism. The fact you can't contribute anything but emotionalism to the argument proves you know less about your party than I do.lmao...you keep thinking that coo coo parker...:thumbsup:

Quikstepper
09-10-2011, 03:05 PM
BTW....dont forget that Repubs are highly patriotic and we also loathe any enemy of America be it foreign or domestic. We love this country almost as much as we love ourselves and anyone who doesnt and is not a complete patriot is nothing but stinking trash to us....


there is nothing patriotic about being a greedy vile piece of GOP crap.

You wouldn't know patriotism if it bit you in the behind. The only thing people like you are deserving of is being kicked OUT of America with your treason & Un American activities. Your hypocrisy is ringing very loud around the country as more people see that they are being sold out by corp whores like yourself. You creepy little freak.

Quikstepper
09-10-2011, 03:10 PM
YOu are in total belief that there are NO democrats in Congress who support globalization? Do you think Hillary would have been an isolationist?

What about the taxation do you find confusing for a democrat to make? Or do you think all democrats are for getting rid of the income tax and replacing it with other taxes?


You are correct...there are what some of us call...Republicrats...Democrats in name only...Hillary? I'm not sure what she would do. maybe a mix of both... is it possible to have globalism & a healthy economy? Not by de regulating everything... that is not the answer. The real problem is how to reign in the global pigs who have no alliance but to lining their own pocket. Money (greed of it) is the root of all evil then we are seeing how there will never be enough for these creepy bastids.

Quikstepper
09-10-2011, 03:12 PM
The shock to the economy would be too great, IMHO. Gradually, cutting more and more with less, would allow Americans to see they don't need to depend on government institutions, but that they could do without a lot of waste and with that, reduce their taxes to nothing.

You will never reduce taxes to nothing.... not without sacrificing a civilized society. Just ask third world nations. How do their people fare? Not very well...

cottonbroker1
09-10-2011, 03:21 PM
You will never reduce taxes to nothing.... not without sacrificing a civilized society. Just ask third world nations. How do their people fare? Not very well...
My wish is that in 2012 when the Repubs take the White House that we would take over one of those pos 3rd world countries and send brainwashed people like you to it to live. BTW, get used to it but Perry is likely going to be our president from 2012-2016 and since he believes in the death penalty and many of us repubs do not we are going to wash out hands of that pos after we have used him up as our president....he is stinking garbage with the blood of innocents on his hands and we will only tolerate that sob long enough to have most or all of our agenda rammed down the dem throat...we owe you guys a little payback for the obama debacle and Perry is just the kind of slimeball we are going to use to do it...get used to it...

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 04:45 PM
You are correct...there are what some of us call...Republicrats...Democrats in name only...Hillary? I'm not sure what she would do. maybe a mix of both... is it possible to have globalism & a healthy economy? Not by de regulating everything... that is not the answer. The real problem is how to reign in the global pigs who have no alliance but to lining their own pocket. Money (greed of it) is the root of all evil then we are seeing how there will never be enough for these creepy bastids.


Now you're seeing it. But up the discussion a bit. WHY do they have no allegiance to the US? DO they care what happens to AMerican workers?

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 04:46 PM
You will never reduce taxes to nothing.... not without sacrificing a civilized society. Just ask third world nations. How do their people fare? Not very well...


Is this the intent of breaking down a people to do your bidding then?

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 04:46 PM
My wish is that in 2012 when the Repubs take the White House that we would take over one of those pos 3rd world countries and send brainwashed people like you to it to live. BTW, get used to it but Perry is likely going to be our president from 2012-2016 and since he believes in the death penalty and many of us repubs do not we are going to wash out hands of that pos after we have used him up as our president....he is stinking garbage with the blood of innocents on his hands and we will only tolerate that sob long enough to have most or all of our agenda rammed down the dem throat...we owe you guys a little payback for the obama debacle and Perry is just the kind of slimeball we are going to use to do it...get used to it...


Perry won't get in.

nondual
09-10-2011, 05:22 PM
BTW....dont forget that Repubs are highly patriotic and we also loathe any enemy of America be it foreign or domestic. We love this country almost as much as we love ourselves and anyone who doesnt and is not a complete patriot is nothing but stinking trash to us....
Didn't you just said it is REALLY every man for himself? How can you act in a patriotic way when every man is for himself? Patriotism requires SELF sacrifice.

EldonG
09-10-2011, 05:25 PM
BTW....dont forget that Repubs are highly patriotic and we also loathe any enemy of America be it foreign or domestic. We love this country almost as much as we love ourselves and anyone who doesnt and is not a complete patriot is nothing but stinking trash to us....
Ummmmbullshit.

By the way, I'm NOT A COMPLETE PATRIOT.

Hudaman
09-10-2011, 05:30 PM
Show me the numbers, projected revenues, where do they come from. I distrust any consumption tax on it's face, because it is by nature regressive. It looks like a jobs killer to me as well.

Cookie Parker
09-10-2011, 05:49 PM
Show me the numbers, projected revenues, where do they come from. I distrust any consumption tax on it's face, because it is by nature regressive. It looks like a jobs killer to me as well.


That's the beauty of the law...it's written....the numbers are hidden.

cottonbroker1
09-10-2011, 06:20 PM
Ummmmbullshit.

By the way, I'm NOT A COMPLETE PATRIOT.
Yea but you and me go way back so you get a free pass...!!! I havent made up my mind about nondual yet...oh wth, he can have a free pass too...you owe me a beer!!

cottonbroker1
09-10-2011, 06:22 PM
Didn't you just said it is REALLY every man for himself? How can you act in a patriotic way when every man is for himself? Patriotism requires SELF sacrifice.
I agree with you 100%...lets both sacrifice ourselves, you go first...!!

EldonG
09-10-2011, 06:22 PM
Yea but you and me go way back so you get a free pass...!!! I havent made up my mind about nondual yet...oh wth, he can have a free pass too...you owe me a beer!!
:p

I do?

One issue...ya gotta come to Dallas to collect...I don't recall that I do, but I don't really give a damn, either. Hell, show up and we'll split a six. Shiner good?

cottonbroker1
09-10-2011, 06:25 PM
:p

I do?

One issue...ya gotta come to Dallas to collect...I don't recall that I do, but I don't really give a damn, either. Hell, show up and we'll split a six. Shiner good?
you really didnt I was just working for a freebie...!!! But oh yea, I love Shiner beer...good Texas beer made by good ole boys for other good ole boys to quinch their thirst with...!! Makes for good drankin'..

EldonG
09-10-2011, 07:18 PM
you really didnt I was just working for a freebie...!!! But oh yea, I love Shiner beer...good Texas beer made by good ole boys for other good ole boys to quinch their thirst with...!! Makes for good drankin'..
When should I expect ya?

cottonbroker1
09-10-2011, 07:25 PM
When should I expect ya?
I really do have to make it down there sometime...!! I have a shit for brains cousin that lives in Arlington that i havent seen in a while...if I get down there sometime soon i will holla at you and we will go hogwild and pigshit crazy just for the sheer hell of it...!!

EldonG
09-10-2011, 07:29 PM
I really do have to make it down there sometime...!! I have a shit for brains cousin that lives in Arlington that i havent seen in a while...if I get down there sometime soon i will holla at you and we will go hogwild and pigshit crazy just for the sheer hell of it...!!
LOL!

I'm a bit saner than that, but I do think it'd be fun to split a six and...oh, hell...who knows? Go chase some women half our age? :p

Hudaman
09-10-2011, 07:41 PM
LOL!

I'm a bit saner than that, but I do think it'd be fun to split a six and...oh, hell...who knows? Go chase some women half our age? :p

The Metroplex is my home away from home, I actually used to have a corporate apartment in Los Colinas but it got too expensive to maintain it. I spend time in Frisco and Southlake every so often now, I do enjoy it there, especially in the winter.

cottonbroker1
09-10-2011, 07:53 PM
LOL!

I'm a bit saner than that, but I do think it'd be fun to split a six and...oh, hell...who knows? Go chase some women half our age? :p
Of course...!! Chasing women is my favorite pastime.....!! #2 pastime is drankin'

EldonG
09-10-2011, 07:57 PM
The Metroplex is my home away from home, I actually used to have a corporate apartment in Los Colinas but it got too expensive to maintain it. I spend time in Frisco and Southlake every so often now, I do enjoy it there, especially in the winter.
Come see me this winter. :thumbsup: I'm guessing you're more of a scotch man, though, right?

Hudaman
09-10-2011, 07:58 PM
Come see me this winter. :thumbsup: I'm guessing you're more of a scotch man, though, right?

On occasion, but more of a beer and rum kinda guy.

EldonG
09-10-2011, 08:06 PM
On occasion, but more of a beer and rum kinda guy.
Cool...that's easier. :)

I had a friend who was into scotch...the prices scared me half to death.

He always shared his 'cheap' bottles...you know...under $100.00 a fifth... :noway:

nondual
09-10-2011, 08:08 PM
I agree with you 100%...lets both sacrifice ourselves, you go first...!!
See? You just don't give a fuck about America. You are probably not even proud of being American, that's why you want to destroy its government. In your mind, the American government is an obstacle, a problem... your enemy.

EldonG
09-10-2011, 08:16 PM
See? You just don't give a fuck about America. You are probably not even proud of being American, that's why you want to destroy its government. In your mind, the American government is an obstacle, a problem... your enemy.
I'm not proud of being an American. I'm American by birth...no great achievement. Why should I be proud of being born? People do it everywhere. I can see more reason to be proud of being Somalian...and surviving to be an adult...

ksec
09-10-2011, 08:23 PM
This ranks right up there with the bachmann light bulb free choice act!
FAIL

Hudaman
09-10-2011, 08:56 PM
Cool...that's easier. :)

I had a friend who was into scotch...the prices scared me half to death.

He always shared his 'cheap' bottles...you know...under $100.00 a fifth... :noway:

I won't invite you to my poker game there. You would definitely have sticker shock.

:noway:

nondual
09-10-2011, 09:12 PM
I'm not proud of being an American. I'm American by birth...no great achievement. Why should I be proud of being born? People do it everywhere. I can see more reason to be proud of being Somalian...and surviving to be an adult...
Compared to most countries around the world, I feel proud of what America had accomplished with its form of government until the Reagan years. Those were really happy and wonderful years, and, compared to what awaits today's kids, I feel really lucky to have grown up during those times (Woodstock ;) ).

I grew in a place like Hazzard County, from the Dukes of Hazzard, but in Puerto Rico. Corrupt sheriff, muscle cars, and everything else included. :)

EldonG
09-10-2011, 09:41 PM
Compared to most countries around the world, I feel proud of what America had accomplished with its form of government until the Reagan years. Those were really happy and wonderful years, and, compared to what awaits today's kids, I feel really lucky to have grown up during those times (Woodstock ;) ).

I grew in a place like Hazzard County, from the Dukes of Hazzard, but in Puerto Rico. Corrupt sheriff, muscle cars, and everything else included. :)
I'm cool with all that...it's just that I didn't have anything to do with it, so I figure I have no right to get a swollen head over it. :p

EldonG
09-10-2011, 09:42 PM
I won't invite you to my poker game there. You would definitely have sticker shock.

:noway:
LOL...

I had friends that had poker games like that...a couple grand on the table...in the 80s...and they were barely 20. :p

chao
09-10-2011, 10:12 PM
I have a problem with regressive taxes like the transaction tax. Someone who is selling their belongings to buy food now has to pay the government a transaction fee on what they sold and also pay the fee on the food they buy. I'm sure Craigslist and eBay will have to report sales. Does anyone believe that fee won't turn up in prices if retailers have to pay it?

Who exactly is the half of this country that isn't paying taxes? It's not the poor. Just look at the tax tables for last year. Not everyone is entitled to credits - there are limitations on that. The unemployed are taxed at 11.5%. I know from experience that the more I owned and earned, the less I paid in taxes because I looked for and took every legitimate deduction I could find.

Quikstepper
09-10-2011, 11:31 PM
My wish is that in 2012 when the Repubs take the White House that we would take over one of those pos 3rd world countries and send brainwashed people like you to it to live. BTW, get used to it but Perry is likely going to be our president from 2012-2016 and since he believes in the death penalty and many of us repubs do not we are going to wash out hands of that pos after we have used him up as our president....he is stinking garbage with the blood of innocents on his hands and we will only tolerate that sob long enough to have most or all of our agenda rammed down the dem throat...we owe you guys a little payback for the obama debacle and Perry is just the kind of slimeball we are going to use to do it...get used to it...


Not in this lifetime you asshole...


...but I'm glad you are showing your true colors...greedy greedy greedy ...hatemogering creepy bastid. Nothing American moral or patriotic about your kind. I won't leave out godly... God will not be mocked by hypocrites like YOU!

cottonbroker1
09-11-2011, 11:24 AM
Not in this lifetime you asshole...


...but I'm glad you are showing your true colors...greedy greedy greedy ...hatemogering creepy bastid. Nothing American moral or patriotic about your kind. I won't leave out godly... God will not be mocked by hypocrites like YOU!
Uh huh...you keep on thinking that...lol..

Cookie Parker
09-11-2011, 11:30 AM
Not in this lifetime you asshole...


...but I'm glad you are showing your true colors...greedy greedy greedy ...hatemogering creepy bastid. Nothing American moral or patriotic about your kind. I won't leave out godly... God will not be mocked by hypocrites like YOU!


God is shunned thanks to the republican made born again evangelical movement.

http://ecumenicalnews.com/article/20110215/mainline-evangelical-churches-shrinking-non-orthodox-groups-increasing-says-report/index.html


A decline in the number of mainline Protestant and Evangelical church goers was again the verdict in this year’s report by the National Council of Churches (NCC), while non-Orthodox groups such as the Mormon church and the Jehova’s Witnesses continue to grow.
Enlarge this Image

A girl looks up into the rafters of Trinity Church, an Episcopal parish, during Christmas Eve service December 24, 2010 in New York City. The Episcopal Church and other mainline Protestant groups reported decline in this year's report from the National Council of Churches. (Photo: AFP)
A girl looks up into the rafters of Trinity Church, an Episcopal parish, during Christmas Eve service December 24, 2010 in New York City. The Episcopal Church and other mainline Protestant groups reported decline in this year's report from the National Council of Churches. (Photo: AFP)

Related
Mainline Churches Shrinking; Catholics, Mormons, AoG Growing: NCC Report

This 2011 Yearbook of American & Canadian Churches showed stable yet slowing trends of growth and decline for the 25 largest churches in the two countries. The figures were collected by the churches in 2009 and reported to the Yearbook in 2010.

The Catholic Church remained at the top of the list with 68.5 million members and a growth of 0.57 percent, while the second largest group, the Southern Baptist Convention (SBC), dropped 0.42 percent to 16,160,088 members.

Along with the SBC, nine other churches, nearly all mainline Protestant groups, reported declines this year, including the United Methodist Church, the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America, the Presbyterian Church (U.S.A.), The Episcopal Church, and the American Baptist Churches in the U.S.A. One evangelical church, the Lutheran Church--Missouri Synod, also reported a loss, dropping 1.08 percent drop to 2,312,111 members.

The largest decline in membership among mainline Protestant groups was in the United Church of Christ, who reported a 2.83 percent drop to a total of 1,080,199 members, while the biggest overall drop was in the historically black Progressive National Baptist Convention, Inc., which fell 14 spots to 25th place this year following a 59.60 percent decrease in membership, which the church says is due in part to a new methodology of counting members.

Meanwhile, several groups that some Christians consider cults grew substantially in 2009, including the Jehova’s Witnesses, which experienced the largest increase, growing 4.37 percent to 1,162,686 members.

The Seventh-Day Adventist Church, which celebrates the Sabbath on Saturday rather than Sunday, also grew, rising 4.31 percent to 1,043,606 members. The group, which didn’t make the list for the last two years, replaced Baptist Bible Fellowship International (BBFI) on this year’s ranking. The Evangelical BBFI was ranked at number 21 last year with 1,200,000 members but was omitted from this year’s list.

The country’s largest non-Orthodox group, the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, rose 1.42 percent to 6,058,907 members and maintained its position as the fourth largest religious group in the nation.

Pentecostals also continued to show a strong vitality, with the Assemblies of God and the Church of God (Cleveland, Tennessee) reporting increases, although the two other charismatic groups on the list, Churches of Christ and the Pentecostal Assemblies of the World, Inc., did not report any membership updates.

Overall, total church membership reported in the 2011 Yearbook is 145,838,339 members, down 1.05 percent over 2010. Notably, nearly half of the churches on the list did not file reports.

I think people are just tired of a religious cult that shoves hatred in your heart all the time and asks for money and more money all the time.

cottonbroker1
09-11-2011, 05:53 PM
God is shunned thanks to the republican made born again evangelical movement.

http://ecumenicalnews.com/article/20110215/mainline-evangelical-churches-shrinking-non-orthodox-groups-increasing-says-report/index.html



I think people are just tired of a religious cult that shoves hatred in your heart all the time and asks for money and more money all the time.
Since so many dems dont believe in God anyway what difference does it make to you or them? BTW, good try injecting what you think is the reason why God is being shunned...blame the Repubs, too funny coo coo parker...!

Quikstepper
09-11-2011, 06:08 PM
God is shunned thanks to the republican made born again evangelical movement.

I think people are just tired of a religious cult that shoves hatred in your heart all the time and asks for money and more money all the time.


I hate to say it but you're correct. It's always people who give God a bad name. So much bad stuff has been done in God's name...from the inquisition to the crusades to jihads & terrorism. I people will begin to realize how important they are to God, and not by human standards either. We are so limited in what we know.

Even God knew the law was powerless without the new divine spirit life there can be no change. Unfortunately the law is how people judge. Sad that faith is not something people can see in action.

I have had a radical change to see what many others are seeing...and even Christians are seeing it too now. We are all human Cookie...but we can still be one. I know seeing many who were made to feel "left" out are embracing what is rightfully their heritage to enjoy too...including God. It's something I hope & pray for.

Don't hold Christians responsible... they are good people but the ALEC group is very deceptive that many are thinking they are standing for some value system but are being deceived by those who only care about profits...not patriotism...not God...just greed.

I am here to say take it back from them. :) It's rightfully ours. That being all of us.

Quikstepper
09-11-2011, 06:13 PM
Uh huh...you keep on thinking that...lol..


You keep ignoring it...hypocrite.

cottonbroker1
09-11-2011, 06:15 PM
You keep ignoring it...hypocrite.
ignore what?

Cookie Parker
09-11-2011, 07:05 PM
Since so many dems dont believe in God anyway what difference does it make to you or them? BTW, good try injecting what you think is the reason why God is being shunned...blame the Repubs, too funny coo coo parker...!


Democrats are Christians....republicans and tea partiers are Born agains...difference you ask?

Christians help the poor as Christ instructed. Born agains, help the rich as the republicans/teaparty has instructed....:thumbsup:

Quikstepper
09-11-2011, 07:13 PM
Democrats are Christians....republicans and tea partiers are Born agains...difference you ask?

Christians help the poor as Christ instructed. Born agains, help the rich as the republicans/teaparty has instructed....:thumbsup:


Well that's not really true either. I think many are seeing what the GOP has turned into. I know many born again Christians...they are good people, just brainwashed & decieved by these ALEC types. Believe me, many are seeing & not liking what they are seeing coming from the republicans.

Cookie Parker
09-11-2011, 07:15 PM
Well that's not really true either. I think many are seeing what the GOP has turned into. I know many born again Christians...they are good people, just brainwashed & decieved by these ALEC types. Believe me, many are seeing & not liking what they are seeing coming from the republicans.


If they are born again, they believe in worshiping the rich....judging...hating...nothing Christ talked about.

I have seen many born agains get OUT of evangelical churches and become Christians again...

Quikstepper
09-11-2011, 07:24 PM
If they are born again, they believe in worshiping the rich....judging...hating...nothing Christ talked about.

I have seen many born agains get OUT of evangelical churches and become Christians again...


LOL...I never back down. Don't think I haven't had my share of disappointments. I will argue my point. I do believe I made some inroads too. I am still in my church. Be consoled friend...God will not be mocked. I find it amazing that when money is involved, people's morals go right out the window. I've seen it even with jews too... it shocks me when people who are suppose to represent God to the world turn their backs when it comes to money. Is there something in the money that does that??? Hmmm??? ;)

Cookie Parker
09-11-2011, 07:25 PM
LOL...I never back down. I will argue my point. I do believe I made some inroads too. I am still in my church. Be consoled friend...God will not be mocked. I find it amazing that when money is involved, people's morals go right out the window. I've seen it even with jews too... it shocks me when people who are suppose to represent God to the world turn their backs when it comes to money. Is there something in the money that does that??? Hmmm??? ;)


Thou shalt have no other gods before me.....falls down when it comes to greed and corruption.

Big Dog
09-13-2011, 09:48 AM
I have a problem with regressive taxes like the transaction tax. Someone who is selling their belongings to buy food now has to pay the government a transaction fee on what they sold and also pay the fee on the food they buy. I'm sure Craigslist and eBay will have to report sales. Does anyone believe that fee won't turn up in prices if retailers have to pay it?

Who exactly is the half of this country that isn't paying taxes? It's not the poor. Just look at the tax tables for last year. Not everyone is entitled to credits - there are limitations on that. The unemployed are taxed at 11.5%. I know from experience that the more I owned and earned, the less I paid in taxes because I looked for and took every legitimate deduction I could find.


Regressive? ... according to Buffet, are current system is regressive.

If a consumption tax becomes regressive. The problem can be alleviated by issuing things like food stamp credits, gas & electric credits, and rent credits.

Craigs? ... I agree, no tax on second hand goods. IOW, no double taxation.



Your unemployment tax argument is ridiculous.

The middle class supports the "Top" that is too big to fail ... and the "bottom" that is too small to fail.


.

.