Too Much Freedom Of the Press?

[Mr. Blue]

Do you think at times the news media pursues topics that are damaging to American interests? I remember a few months after 9/11 the local news stations here went on a tear of showing different places that are vulnerable to attack, whether it be the ports, airports, the border, subways etc. Was this giving too much information away? Was it responsible? Should they have chosen not to run some stories and instead contact the government to find solutions?

Now, I know people like saying that we have less freedoms now than ever and in some cases it's true. During WWII though, newspapers would often have to wait months before they published a story and then the story would have to be reviewed by the government in some cases.

Has the news media become destructive to American interests? Abu Ghraib for example. Should the press have ran with that story or should have they waited because it would escalate the tensions in the ME? What about Newsweek running an inaccurate story about the Koran being flushed at Gitmo? Or The New York Times leaking information about certain government programs that were being used to track potential terrorists?

I might be playing devil's advocate on this topic, but I'd like to see people's take on it.

[Tommy]

My sister married a loony Arab

this guy is so far gone he told me that if America went to war with Iran he MIGHT go back to Iran and fight in the war against American troops

anyway my sister told me that he has a satellite setup so he can watch
Aljazeera


she told me when ever they show pictures of america they show the burned out buildings in the south bronx and all the video is from nasty drug corners

[Bill]

Only the President, as Commander In Cheif, has the authority to leak news. And when he does it we have to trust their is a good reason.

We need some treason trials in this country.

[Mr. Blue]

My sister married a loony Arab

this guy is so far gone he told me that if America went to war with Iran he MIGHT go back to Iran and fight in the war against American troops

anyway my sister told me that he has a satellite setup so he can watch
Aljazeera


she told me when ever they show pictures of america they show the burned out buildings in the south bronx and all the video is from nasty drug corners

lol, my brother married and Arab. My sister married a jew. Family reunions are really interesting.

[Mr. Blue]

Only the President, as Commander In Cheif, has the authority to leak news. And when he does it we have to trust their is a good reason.

We need some treason trials in this country.

Well, yes I agree with that, but there is investigative reporting that may or may not undermine the security of America. Like Channel 7 news having their reporters going out in little rubber rafts to show how unprotected the us ports are...should they be doing stuff like that? I mean, maybe report their findings first and then wait a month, then publish the story.

I think there's times when the media steps too far for ratings...where they put the public interest in jeopardy.

I mean during FDR's term, the news media wouldn't even post a picture of FDR in a wheelchair because they wanted America to feel like they had a strong leader, they ignored his affair for the same reason...could you imagine that happening today? They'd have pictures of him getting a blowjob in the wheelchair and they would post it on the front cover.

[Kinky Jones]

the military channel in a time of war is brilliant, giving out tons of info on our strategies in Iraq, are we still fighting a war there? if that doesn't hurt our interests then f everything else too

[AJ]

The Times has committed a crime against the United States by printing details of a classified and completely legal anti terror program

I was one of the proud protesters last week
we rallied in front of the Times building in NYC
I believe we sent a message that was heard loud and clear

[Mr. Blue]

the military channel in a time of war is brilliant, giving out tons of info on our strategies in Iraq, are we still fighting a war there? if that doesn't hurt our interests then f everything else too

lol, okay yeah...also whenever they have military experts or terrorist experts that give detailed information on the dangers/strategies, etc. At times I feel like I could wage a successful war against someone just because of the sheer amount of details given out on the news.

The problem is, the American media has a certain conceit about it, like perhaps only Americans are watching it. CNN / Fox News, etc have become world media and I think they're part of the reason why America is so poorly received on the world stage of late.

The News media, both right and left, aren't seeking the truth and seeing the bigger picture like they used to...it's a business, it's about the sensational, it's about ratings at all costs.

When was the last positive news story you've heard? They're becoming rarer and rarer...why is that? I could use a little good news from time to time.

[Bill]

Well, at least Israel is kicking a little Hezbolla terrorist ass!

Now, if only they would blow up that mosque on the temple mount, we can get this party started.

[SirMoby]

History shows the loss of freedom has always started with controlling the news. Our current President labels everything as national security. Look at some of the signing statements.

Seriously, do you think that terrorists that were smart enough to be in the FBI's radar screen when Dubya took office could 18 months later do what they did on 9/11 if they used traceable phone calls for communication?

The New York Times did their job and quite frankly are doing more to protect your freedoms then our President.

Please read the first amendment one more time.

[CatsEye]

Wake up and smell the hypocrisy. You can shout "treason" all you want, but there is such a thing as free speech - revisit the First Amendment.

For those ranting about the media outlets and needing treason trials, start digging in your beloved Dear Leader's backyard just to make sure that all acts of "treason" are exposed during this election year:

Jimmy Gurule, Under Secretary of Treasury for Enforcement, provided this foreign press center briefing (http://fpc.state.gov/13337.htm) back in 2002. He pretty much detailed the U.S. strategy and methods for tracking terrorist financial transactions. It's still on the US Department of State website. Read it for yourself (http://fpc.state.gov/13337.htm).

Either Gurule and the entire Treasury Department staff that participated in the release of this information at the press briefing back in 2002 should be brought up on charges of treason, or the Republicans behind this McCarthyistic assault on the press need to back off and concede their hypocrisy.

I don't blindly trust our current commander in chief to leak any information that doesn't directly benefit him and his cronies; but then, I can think for myself. And as for investigative reporting that shows how unprotected things still are, I don't think it's a disservice. After the shitload of money that's been spent on Homeland Suck-urity (and diverted away from programs that address long-going real problems) and all the chest pounding macho posturing that contributes to the spiraling deficit and culture of living in fear, I have a right to know that someone can still paddle up to a water intake tube for a nuclear reactor cooling pipe and screw with it. That our ports still aren't secure. That my retired math teacher aunt got put on the No Fly List for no reason, and has no way to get off that list until she dies (and probably not even then).

All this, while there are more American children living below the poverty line than there were 5 years ago.

Keep thinking the Emperor has clothes. Me, I like to be informed. And I have a right to it.

[Bill]

You guys keep forgetting that we are at war and our boys are dying.

[Mr. Blue]

So, nothing should be held back in the press?

In NYC, the newspaper held back on a terrorist plot on the subways to give the police a chance to respond to the threat. It turned out to be nothing, but do you criticize the NY papers for holding back on a story because it involved a matter of security?

I'm not just isolating the Times story, but a wider perspective on the news in general. People like to make the news media out to be this knight in shining armor, but they're just as tarnished as the politicians they cover. They're going after ratings pure and simple. Do they hold back on stories that could possibly hurt Americans? Do they even do backup checks on the story?

Here's an example:

Newsweek apologized yesterday for an inaccurate report on the treatment of detainees that triggered several days of rioting in Afghanistan and other countries in which at least 15 people died.

They were foaming at the mouth for a story that was salacious enough to sell a few magazines that they didn't check the story completely and the resulting domino effect caused 15 people to die.

I'm not saying there should be government regulation of the press, but I think the press should exercise some responsibility in the way they report and they should consider the effect of such reporting abroad.

Also, America does have a liberal usage of Freedom of the Press, but our compatriots across the pond, you know, the ones always criticizing the U.S., has a thing called, The European Convention on Human Rights, what clause do they have added? "...in the interests of national security, territorial integrity or public safety, for the prevention of disorder or crime, for the protection of health or morals, for the protection of the reputation or the rights of others, for preventing the disclosure of information received in confidence, or for maintaining the authority and impartiality of the judiciary"

I'm not saying the Euro's got it right, but it is an interesting clause to add.

[SirMoby]

You guys keep forgetting that we are at war and our boys are dying.
What did the press release that is putting our boys and WOMEN in harms way?

My thought is that they should be showing far more of the war. Mainly the horrors of war the American press isn't allowed to show any of the damage that is done by war.

War in general is a terrible, terrible thing and everyone that supports it should see it.

[Bill]

What did the press release that is putting our boys and WOMEN in harms way?

I was speaking colloquially, for the sake of brevity, and admittedly because I knew it would tweak the leftys. I haven't heard of any women soldiers being killed lately tho.

I agree, show more pictures of the war, the explosions and gunfire are cool.

It's nice to see how well American weapons perform.

[Kinky Jones]

It's nice to see how well American weapons perform.

it would be refreshing if the moral nuthuggers valued human life instead of just American lives

[juggernaut]

You guys keep forgetting that we are at war and our boys are dying.Bill I know first hand where you are comming from. I'm in with those boys. In fact I re-up this friday. But I have to agree with some of the people here. This goes much deeper then the press. I don't agree that the press should be speaking out about things concerning national security. But that fact remains and I was just talking to people about this yesterday. There are serious problems with the security in this country. I know of 2 bases in the states that over the last month have "lost" laptops that had sensitive info on them. I kept pressing the issue and was told yesterday it was up to the commander of the base to handle it. I told them, it seems to me people only handle things the correct way when the press finds out about it. I was in charge of an IT security section for 2 years and was a totaly shit head to everyone. I wanted to make it clear to them I would not deal with anyone fucking around on my watch. I did not care if I knew you for years, if you fucked up, you might have gotten someone killed and because of that you were going to pay a heavy price. Bad part was when I pushed again, things in the end got tossed under the rug. I left that job for those very reasons, only to find myself most likly heading back soon. The only thing I can do to keep my mind from exploding is tell myself to keep trying.

[juggernaut]

Heres more proof things are just fucked up.
http://www.nj1015.com/absolutenm/templates/?a=3735&z=3

"Two Navy Computers Reported Stolen in New Jersey
Thursday, July 27, 2006 - Associated Press

Two laptop computers with personal data on about 31-thousand Navy recruiters and their prospective recruits were stolen in New Jersey in June and July.

The thefts, made public yesterday, mark the third time in little more than a month that personal data on Navy personnel has been lost or unintentionally released publicly over the Internet.

Officials say both computers were stolen from Navy recruiting offices.

One laptop was reported stolen from a Trenton site in early June, and the other was taken from a Jersey City site in early July.

Lieutenant Bashon Manna, a Navy spokesman, says there's been no reports of illegal usage of the personal data and that the Navy is identifying the affected individuals.

Manna says the information on the laptops was secured by several layers of password protection."

Sure it was. I have software that will bypass passwords in 5 minutes and it's not brute force stuff..

[Linkster]

As far as the stolen computers - that has been an ongoing effort (insiders at the NSA say by friends of theirs working for the NSA) over the last two years - there are thousands of cases just like that in every little town across the US - and most insiders say that the info is being used to build a better database of info on American citizens by the government.

In that same vein - and getting back to the media stuff - there has been a huge "yell of treason" with the NY Times breaking the story about wiretaps, telephone and data monitoring etc.
The sad part is that this has been public information (and knowledge for those of us that care) since the 1980s - a former NSA specialist that worked on the original wiretapping of American citizens program in the 70s and 80s exposed it in a paper he wrote - and he provided a lot more detail than the NY Times and other papers did - so if you want someone to "blame" for exposing all of this stuff - you might go back 25 years to when the terrorists first got their hands on the information.

The current administration has been trying to stifle the "free press" by suiciding a few editor in chiefs of major news organizations (search google for news about editors found in the Chesapeake Bay recently if youre real interested), sending anthrax to some of the more liberal news anchors, setting up a few of them to report on fraudulant stories etc.

If we get rid of the ability of US citizens to have total access to the full story - then we have just destroyed our republic - and I will physically fight against anyones attempt to do that (just as I did when serving in the military for 12 years) - however, I will also fight to preserve your right to express your opinions as that is an equal right I swore an oath to defend - seems the current government forgot that little oath they swore to.

/added - if ya need a list of all ofthe computer/data thefts hit me up and Ill send you a link to the charts that have been maintained

[Linkster]

BTW - just so you dont think Im always this "serious"

http://www.markfiore.com/animation/snuggly.html

[juggernaut]

As far as the stolen computers - that has been an ongoing effort (insiders at the NSA say by friends of theirs working for the NSA) over the last two years - there are thousands of cases just like that in every little town across the US - and most insiders say that the info is being used to build a better database of info on American citizens by the government.Link this does not make any sence, the computers that are being taken are military systems. Not all of them but most of them, so building a DB on american citizens may surly be a goal it can't be with these systems as the DB is already there. Shoot they have my DNA on record along with countless others I think that's more then enough. I think it's deeper then that, I think its Americans who need cash and are selling the info.

In that same vein - and getting back to the media stuff - there has been a huge "yell of treason" with the NY Times breaking the story about wiretaps, telephone and data monitoring etc.
The sad part is that this has been public information (and knowledge for those of us that care) since the 1980s - a former NSA specialist that worked on the original wiretapping of American citizens program in the 70s and 80s exposed it in a paper he wrote - and he provided a lot more detail than the NY Times and other papers did - so if you want someone to "blame" for exposing all of this stuff - you might go back 25 years to when the terrorists first got their hands on the information. I think this whole wire tapping thing is out of hand. I agree that it does place an strange amount of knoweldge at the finger tips but still this is mainly to get people who are already under investigation. But I do think that 1 or 2 off the wall people could easily use this for bad purposes and I'm sure its not as easy as most think. To many government employees are scared of the people they work with in order to commit a crime. 1/2 the time they think they are being tested and stick strickly by the rules because of it. But still like I said a small group of people with access to that power could abuse it.

The current administration has been trying to stifle the "free press" by suiciding a few editor in chiefs of major news organizations (search google for news about editors found in the Chesapeake Bay recently if youre real interested), sending anthrax to some of the more liberal news anchors, setting up a few of them to report on fraudulant stories etc. Come on now. I'm not saying strange things don't happen but to many x-files shows can make people thing the worst of any government. I can see the set up on news storys and maybe in the worste cases dropping one or two in a river. But it's all a little extreame for me. Like I said to many x-file shows make people want to see what's not really there. Besides who is writing this stuff on google? What makes them more creditible then the next guy. Proof is everything and one thing the x-file junkies never seem to have is proof. In today's day and age with all this technology I find it amazing that no one has proof of space ships yet. A man I knew who worked on the first oribiter for IBM once asked me if I belived in UFO's. I told him yes. He then asked me why they were comming here? I told him to watch us and experiment on us. He said why do they always seem to do it at night? I told him so no one can see them. Then he said well if that's the case why do they always seem to have flashing lights, if they don't want anyone to see them? Government secerts should remain that way for a reason.

If we get rid of the ability of US citizens to have total access to the full story - then we have just destroyed our republic - and I will physically fight against anyones attempt to do that (just as I did when serving in the military for 12 years) - however, I will also fight to preserve your right to express your opinions as that is an equal right I swore an oath to defend - seems the current government forgot that little oath they swore to.

/added - if ya need a list of all ofthe computer/data thefts hit me up and Ill send you a link to the charts that have been maintainedI'm on the fence with this one, total access for somethings ok. For others, no way. Problem with the press is they don't see it any other way. They sit in AC'd rooms and just look to get the numbers from the story. They do not look months or years down the road as to what they produce can harm. I agree that if the government is doing fucked up shit then the press should report it. But if the government is doing something for the safty of the people and it's a little shaddy, then they should back off. In the end they will only hurt themselves. If some people inside this country succeed in toppling this government, they have no real idea what they will unleash. It's like a pandoras box. Like the Chinese say, be careful what you wish for.
Big high 5 on your 12 years. Eye opening aint it. Seeing some of the inner workings make you see things in a whole new light. Sometimes I wish I could hold on to the old bliss of not knowing anything.

[Mr. Blue]

If we get rid of the ability of US citizens to have total access to the full story - then we have just destroyed our republic - and I will physically fight against anyones attempt to do that (just as I did when serving in the military for 12 years) - however, I will also fight to preserve your right to express your opinions as that is an equal right I swore an oath to defend - seems the current government forgot that little oath they swore to.

The US citizen almost never had total access to the full story. In fact we have more freedom of the press than we've ever had prior. So much freedom of the press that we can't get the best people running for political office because their lives face such a harsh scrutiny that only a megalomaniac would run for political office.

I'm not saying the government should intervene with freedom of the press, but I want people to start realizing that the media isn't some altruistic body defending the citizens of America.

They're a business, they're not motivated by a search for truth or an unbiased view. They're hell bent on ratings, money, what share of the market they control, and they put so much of their own spin on topics that you usually have to read 20 different sources to get a true picture of anything going on.

Journalists have a responsibility that should be first towards truth and an unbiased assessment of the situation...but that's a long gone notion...now it centers around what will get some ratings.

I'll give you a non-political type example. When a pretty young caucasion woman goes missing, they'll have stories about it none stop for months or years. Natalie Holloway is a perfect example of that. 18 year old, gone missing in Aruba, possible sex / rape / date drugs / etc.

Now, how many black women go missing each year and do they get any coverage? How about ugly women...do they get any news coverage when they go missing? lol, I've joked about this that if you're a fat ugly person and you get kidnapped, good luck, because no news agency will bother looking for you.

See what I mean? The news is no longer a source for information...it's become entertainment. Entertainment that's wrapped in a news format done for ratings is a very dangerous path to go down.

[Kinky Jones]

when they start telling you stuff like "the no spin zone" and "the most trusted name in news" you gotta take a step back and wonder why they repeatadly have to slam that phrase into your brain??? oh yes so eventually you believe it :D

[Mr. Blue]

when they start telling you stuff like "the no spin zone" and "the most trusted name in news" you gotta take a step back and wonder why they repeatadly have to slam that phrase into your brain??? oh yes so eventually you believe it :D

LOL, exactly! Right, Left, it doesn't matter...the news has become entertainment. Soon it'll be the modern equivalent to the Circus Maximus or the Roman Coliseum. Journalistic responsibility is taking a back seat to ratings.