View Full Version : Orrin Hatch Supports Building Of Park51
Orrin Hatch Supports Building Of Park51: 'I'd Be The First To Stand Up For Their Rights
(http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/08/31/hatch-supports-building-o_n_700387.html?ref=fb&src=sp#sb=833258,b=facebook)
Good on Senator Orrin Hatch (R-Utah).
ThinkProgress's Alex Seitz-Wald has video of Hatch giving an interview to Salt Lake City's Fox 13 News, in which he offers up soft-spoken yet strong support for the Cordoba Initiative's Park51 project in Manhattan.
Let's be honest about it, in the First Amendment, religious freedom, religious expression, that really express matters to the Constitution. So, if the Muslims own that property, that private property, and they want to build a mosque there, they should have the right to do so. The only question is are they being insensitive to those who suffered the loss of loved ones? We know there are Muslims killed on 9/11 too and we know it's a great religion. I know a lot of Muslim people who I have a very great regard for, not the least of which is Muhammad Ali. He's a great friend of mine. But as far as their right to build that mosque, they have that right.
The question is, should they? Is it insensitive not to, in the eyes of the majority of New Yorkers? It's going to come down to New York and what New York decides to do.
Hatch went on to add that as a legal scholar, "I have the tendency, when it comes to religious liberty issues, to always uphold the rights of legitimate churches... I just think that what's made this country great is we have religious freedom. That's not the only thing, but it's one of the most important things in the Constitution."
Hatch has something of a personal stake in the matter as well, and he recalls an instance in which the late Senator Ted Kennedy lent a hand to get a Mormon temple built in Massachusetts, despite some local obstruction.
Hatch also seems to have a proper grasp of geography:
There's a question of whether it's too close to the 9/11 area, but it's a few blocks away, it isn't right there. Frankly, there are a lot of people who feel, including the mayor of New York, that they should have every right to do it, and that New Yorkers should support them...And there's a huge, I think, lack of support throughout the country for Islam to build that mosque there, but that should not make a difference if they decide to do it. I'd be the first to stand up for their rights.
It's probably worth your time to revisit Alex Pareene's compendium of the "Heroes, villains, and cowards of the so-called 'ground zero mosque,'" if only to be baffled by the people who haven't the guts to join Senator Hatch in standing up for some basic freedoms.
MintJulep
09-01-2010, 01:39 AM
Another career RINO and useful idiot for Islam who needs to go. Utah got rid of Bennett, now they need to show Hatch the door.
A terror mosque at Ground Zero is inappropriate and unwelcome.
Bill Cosby
09-01-2010, 01:44 AM
But beck might like him, he is a morman like him............
MintJulep
09-01-2010, 01:50 AM
It doesn't matter to me if Glenn Beck comes out in support of a terror mosque, I still wouldn't want it there. It's disrespectful and doesn't belong there any more than a monument to the KKK should be built at a black church the KKK burned down a decade before.
It's not a matter of property rights or religious freedom, it's a matter of RESPECT.
Bill Cosby
09-01-2010, 02:01 AM
You are welcome to your opinion........... Neither of us live there so que sera, sera.........
I think it will be possible for beck & his universal ecumenical clergy to agree to a Mosque there.......... Long as they wrap it in the flag......
Bill Cosby
09-01-2010, 03:21 AM
LOL @Mint Julip...''terror mosque..'' Unreal..
Will they train the ''terror babies'' at the ''terror mosque?''
But back on topic.I'm a New York City Native,who also lived in Utah for a few years. I come from a strong NYPD-FDNY background.Several people in my family worked at Ground Zero in the aftermath of the attack. (3 total-2 NYPD,and 1 FDNY).
My cousin Kim who worked the site the longest of all,spending over 3 months there with her Police dog Sean.Her and Sean,along with many other service dogs and their handlers sifted through the debris looking first for survivors,then for human remains.
As a result of her exposure to the toxins in the air there,Kim is now medically retired after almost 20 years on the job and suffers from a variety of respiratory ailments.She's not in good shape at all..
With the exception of my cousin Jimmy who worked the site for a few weeks,my other two cousins who worked at G.Z.are in complete support of the Mosque.As Kim puts it, ''we should be better than the scumbags who brought the towers down.'' I agree.
While I lived in Utah,I rarely had many nice things to say about Senator Hatch.I found him to be a hard line right winger and would usually be in opposition to most things he supported.On this this though, he nailed it..
I've enclosed a video,that features yours truly,my immediate family as well as my cousins.As I've said..Two out of three of them support the building of the Mosque as well..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VcZa_Vud9yM
Awesome clip:thumbsup:
THnx for sharing that..............
Very powerful........ :D
Mr, gone
09-01-2010, 06:28 AM
Thanks from me also Hamill, for being this open about sharing a piece of your life with others.:thumbsup: It makes me wonder why so many people on this forum are afraid to 'show face'. Maybe the fear mongering has also caused a little paranoia.:dunno:
Hamill, I'm sorry your cousin is now sick... damn shame
Your family slide show was very touching
foxbaron
09-01-2010, 09:22 AM
It doesn't matter to me if Glenn Beck comes out in support of a terror mosque, I still wouldn't want it there. It's disrespectful and doesn't belong there any more than a monument to the KKK should be built at a black church the KKK burned down a decade before.
It's not a matter of property rights or religious freedom, it's a matter of RESPECT.
Minty, they just don' get it and probably never will/
serum114
09-01-2010, 10:30 AM
Minty, they just don' get it and probably never will/
No, I think we get it. I just don't think the country should be run by emotionalism. The nation wide nervous breakdown this country had after 9/11 doesn't need to continue.
MintJulep
09-01-2010, 11:21 AM
Minty, they just don' get it and probably never will/Oh no, I think they do "get" it. It simply doesn't matter to them if this mosque is financed by Iran and Saudi Arabia with definite plans to be a Shariah law/terrorist recruitment center.
"Terrorists have feelings too!"
A nativity scene induces an instant stroke with these types, but they will shill for and defend a "religion" that commonly enslaves women in their homes and stones people to death like a mama pitbull protecting her pups.
It's kind of mind-boggling, but, not really......
MintJulep
09-01-2010, 11:27 AM
No, I think we get it. I just don't think the country should be run by emotionalism. The nation wide nervous breakdown this country had after 9/11 doesn't need to continue.Translation: "I'd like to shut these complainers up."
Is that why you have such an affinity for radical Islam? Because they put into action what you can only fantasize about doing -- literally shutting people up?
Parade Rain
09-01-2010, 11:40 AM
Wow, not a fucking word from the haters on Hamill's post and video.
Screeching on for days about "sensitivity". Your words are hollow and fake, haters.
LIKE YOU.
Hamill, great slide show. My grandfather was a horse Marine before he became a beat cop in Hell's Kitchen. What tune is that?
That's fucked up about your cousin. It's horrible that the Bush administration didn't do anything to help out the real heros of 9/11.
No, I think we get it. I just don't think the country should be run by emotionalism. The nation wide nervous breakdown this country had after 9/11 doesn't need to continue.
I see this trait in all the Tea Baggers. They refuse to be swayed by the facts.
Bill Cosby
09-01-2010, 01:22 PM
Hamill, great slide show. My grandfather was a horse Marine before he became a beat cop in Hell's Kitchen. What tune is that?
That's fucked up about your cousin. It's horrible that the Bush administration didn't do anything to help out the real heros of 9/11.
yea I was wondering that as well as I listen to the clip........... Nice.. :thumbsup:
FredK
09-01-2010, 02:09 PM
........
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VcZa_Vud9yM
:thumbsup: Thanks for sharing. :thumbsup:
MintJulep
09-02-2010, 12:48 PM
3aFBAyccqXE
Bill Cosby
09-02-2010, 01:00 PM
That sounds a lot like the internet............ Especially back in the infancy of boards, AOL etc.........
Everyone was a cop or a karate expert........... AaahhhhHHH!!! the good O' days when I would be threaten almost every day......:lmao2:
http://www.steveweisslive.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/a-InternetToughGuy1.jpg
What was the tune on your clip????????
doctordog
09-02-2010, 01:09 PM
LOL @Mint Julip...''terror mosque..'' Unreal..
Will they train the ''terror babies'' at the ''terror mosque?''
But back on topic.I'm a New York City Native,who also lived in Utah for a few years. I come from a strong NYPD-FDNY background.Several people in my family worked at Ground Zero in the aftermath of the attack. (3 total-2 NYPD,and 1 FDNY).
My cousin Kim who worked the site the longest of all,spending over 3 months there with her Police dog Sean.Her and Sean,along with many other service dogs and their handlers sifted through the debris looking first for survivors,then for human remains.
As a result of her exposure to the toxins in the air there,Kim is now medically retired after almost 20 years on the job and suffers from a variety of respiratory ailments.She's not in good shape at all..
With the exception of my cousin Jimmy who worked the site for a few weeks,my other two cousins who worked at G.Z.are in complete support of the Mosque.As Kim puts it, ''we should be better than the scumbags who brought the towers down.'' I agree.
While I lived in Utah,I rarely had many nice things to say about Senator Hatch.I found him to be a hard line right winger and would usually be in opposition to most things he supported.On this this though, he nailed it..
I've enclosed a video,that features yours truly,my immediate family as well as my cousins.As I've said..Two out of three of them support the building of the Mosque as well..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VcZa_Vud9yM
Great video, so sorry about Kim. I have great respect for the men and women that serve us as police officers and firemen.:thumbsup:
That sounds a lot like the internet............ Especially back in the infancy of boards, AOL etc.........
Everyone was a cop or a karate expert........... AaahhhhHHH!!! the good O' days when I would be threaten almost every day......:lmao2:
http://www.steveweisslive.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/a-InternetToughGuy1.jpg
What was the tune on your clip????????
Where did you get that picture of Wayers?
I was just relating to Hamill's video. My gramps actually was 6'4". But he wasn't a powerlifter; he was Jack Demsey's sparring partner. :D
doctordog
09-02-2010, 01:43 PM
Where did you get that picture of Wayers?
I was just relating to Hamill's video. My gramps actually was 6'4". But he wasn't a powerlifter; he was Jack Demsey's sparring partner. :D
he probably found it with yours below:
http://blogimages.project76.tv/G4p2fq_ASM-573-Page-017.jpg
BlueSpoon
09-02-2010, 08:56 PM
Another career RINO and useful idiot for Islam who needs to go. Utah got rid of Bennett, now they need to show Hatch the door.
A terror mosque at Ground Zero is inappropriate and unwelcome.
When his term is up he will be out. I'm working towards it now along with thousands of others. :thumbsup:
BlueSpoon
09-02-2010, 08:58 PM
You are welcome to your opinion........... Neither of us live there so que sera, sera.........
I think it will be possible for beck & his universal ecumenical clergy to agree to a Mosque there.......... Long as they wrap it in the flag......
You have a crush on Beck don't you? LOL
You can't stop talking about him. :lmao2: :lmao2:
BlueSpoon
09-02-2010, 09:08 PM
Hamill, great slide show. My grandfather was a horse Marine before he became a beat cop in Hell's Kitchen. What tune is that?
That's fucked up about your cousin. It's horrible that the Bush administration didn't do anything to help out the real heros of 9/11.
Why would the Bush administration do something for people doing their job, their chosen profession? The Bush admin didn't bring the towers down. Terrorists did. Perhaps the terrorists should do something.
Parade Rain
09-04-2010, 03:48 PM
Thanks Wayers..Kim is good people..
On a not-totally-unrelated note, I'm going to attempt a chocolate egg cream using soy milk. :thumbsup:
And yes, I'll have to "make do" with Hershey's.
CosmicRocker
09-04-2010, 04:25 PM
just build it or don't build it.
It;s a freaking mosque, as useless as a church, Buddist temple, or any other religious building.
Maybe they can put in some loudspeakers, and play hip hop dorab music.
Honestly -even though I am Buddist, in no way do I need a temple.
You dont need no church house
And you dont need no temple
You dont need no rosary beads or them books to read
To see that you have fallen
If you open up your heart
You will know what I mean
Weve been kept down so long
Someones thinking that were all green
And while the pope owns 51% of general motors
And the stock exchange is the only thing hes qualified to quote us
The lord is awaiting on you all to awaken and see
By chanting the names of the lord and youll be free
just build it or don't build it.
It;s a freaking mosque, as useless as a church, Buddist temple, or any other religious building.
Maybe they can put in some loudspeakers, and play hip hop dorab music.
Honestly -even though I am Buddist, in no way do I need a temple.
You dont need no church house
And you dont need no temple
You dont need no rosary beads or them books to read
To see that you have fallen
If you open up your heart
You will know what I mean
Weve been kept down so long
Someones thinking that were all green
And while the pope owns 51% of general motors
And the stock exchange is the only thing hes qualified to quote us
The lord is awaiting on you all to awaken and see
By chanting the names of the lord and youll be free
Temples are contrary to Buddhism.
CosmicRocker
09-04-2010, 08:35 PM
Temples are contrary to Buddhism.
You can;t just make a vague statement like that, I don't use them -I have no need, the world is all I need.
Others prefer to gather as Monks do where their chanting, and "minfulness" is enhanced by a temple. A place of respect and holiness
If you mean because Buddha is not a god, i agree, but there are reasons for temples, if you choose to use them.
There are hundreds of sects; nothing I know of in Buddism prohibits a temple.
But I do agree when Buddha confronted Mora under the Bodi tree, he put one hand on the ground when Mora asked him "who will witnees your victory over my delusion" ( I'm sure you know that Mora was all about confusion of the mind).
Putting his hand on the ground was his way of saying "the earth is my witness"
Do me a favor - if youre' going to make such blanket utterences, please flesh them out
You can;t just make a vague statement like that, I don't use them -I have no need, the world is all I need.
Others prefer to gather as Monks do where their chanting, and "minfulness" is enhanced by a temple. A place of respect and holiness
If you mean because Buddha is not a god, i agree, but there are reasons for temples, if you choose to use them.
There are hundreds of sects; nothing I know of in Buddism prohibits a temple.
But I do agree when Buddha confronted Mora under the Bodi tree, he put one hand on the ground when Mora asked him "who will witnees your victory over my delusion" ( I'm sure you know that Mora was all about confusion of the mind).
Putting his hand on the ground was his way of saying "the earth is my witness"
Do me a favor - if youre' going to make such blanket utterences, please flesh them out
Yes I can.
CosmicRocker
09-04-2010, 08:40 PM
Yes I can.
"yes we can" if you want to descend to bumper sticker posts.
Bill Cosby
09-04-2010, 08:52 PM
The tune is named ''Blues Beneath The Surface." I thought it fit,seeing as we have an unusually high concentration of cops in our family. Until only a few years ago, member of my family has been on the NYPD since the late 1890's..
But God,the Bush Administration DID do something for the first responders.They had the EPA LIE to them and say the air quality was safe,and instructed them to NOT WEAR breathing apparatus that might have saved them.Most people don't know that over 900 first responders have died, mostly of lung disease since 9-11..What a fucking coincidence..
Everyone but the right wing knows the GOP doesn't give a rats ass about the 9-11 responders.They only ass rape the corpses when it will further a poltical objective..
Don't believe me? Watch this short little C-SPAN clip of republicans,after blocking extended health care benefits to sick 9-11 responders, being called out for the filthy scumbags they are.The republicans, in their newfound role of watching spending,cited it would add ''to and entitlement culture.'' and that the rest of the country shouldn't be responsible for the medical bills of NYC Firefighters..
They talk all this head about ground zero and the mosque..It's all bullshit.If Ground Zero was such ''hallowed ground'' then why are they building yet another skyscraper there? Why isn't the area being turned into a memeorial park? Why, because they don't really give a shit..They worship one thing,MONEY.
In the meantime, they always bring up 9-11 as the reason we must surrender civil liberties, fight wars, fuck with Muslims,go into mindless debt.But, when it comes to helping the people that pulled out decomposed bits and pieces of dead victims out of the rubble the republicans say.. ''fuck them, go pound sand, we're not adding to the debt..''
Watch for yourself...
W4zwCMf8dsc
Thnx for the song......... & awesome post.... :thumbsup:
I seen that Anthony Weiner clip before.......... I use to be in that congressional distric & would vote for him now if I could..........
That man has some balls.............. Something not often found in those snob filled halls & Gucci pants...............
Bill Cosby
09-04-2010, 08:54 PM
You can;t just make a vague statement like that, I don't use them -I have no need, the world is all I need.
Others prefer to gather as Monks do where their chanting, and "minfulness" is enhanced by a temple. A place of respect and holiness
If you mean because Buddha is not a god, i agree, but there are reasons for temples, if you choose to use them.
There are hundreds of sects; nothing I know of in Buddism prohibits a temple.
But I do agree when Buddha confronted Mora under the Bodi tree, he put one hand on the ground when Mora asked him "who will witnees your victory over my delusion" ( I'm sure you know that Mora was all about confusion of the mind).
Putting his hand on the ground was his way of saying "the earth is my witness"
Do me a favor - if youre' going to make such blanket utterences, please flesh them out
You can argue w/ gOd.............:lmao2:
I was wonder what the basis is for that as well........ First I ever heard anything like that.......... Not that I really care either, but hey, Buddhist have a right to know.....:D
CosmicRocker
09-04-2010, 09:20 PM
You can argue w/ gOd.............:lmao2:
I was wonder what the basis is for that as well........ First I ever heard anything like that.......... Not that I really care either, but hey, Buddhist have a right to know.....:Dbasis for what?(not following)
LOL There is a gOd, and we can debate.
As to God, I sent her a postcard, and never got an answer.
Even addresed it to "the Pearly Gates" c/o St. Peter.
Bill Cosby
09-04-2010, 09:24 PM
basis for what?(not following)
LOL There is a gOd, and we can debate.
As to God, I sent her a postcard, and never got an answer.
Even addresed it to "the Pearly Gates" c/o St. Peter.
It is an old sayin "you can't argue w/ God"..............
The basis for his comment about the temples....... Have you ever heard that??
Maybe it is a new fundi-Buddhist cult......:lmao2:
CosmicRocker
09-04-2010, 09:28 PM
It is an old sayin "you can't argue w/ God"..............
The basis for his comment about the temples....... Have you ever heard that??
Maybe it is a new fundi-Buddhist cult......:lmao2:
He didn't give me enough info to repond, clearly Buddist have temples.
Buddha lived a humble life after he left the palace, i'm really not sure what his point is, so I'm not going to guess or "put words in gOd's mouth" ;)
Some yogis live in Himalayan caves for years, Buddism is not monolythic,
the only things that connect all Buddists are the 4 Noble Truths , and the Eight Fold Noble Path.
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