Smaller Government

[SortofLiberal]

I wonder if those mindless sheep that are flocking to the Teabaggers are really listening to what they are saying or all they hear are the buzz words like "smaller government" . . . "lower taxes".

I wonder if they realize exactly how much smaller government these people are advocating? I wonder if they realize that when they say they want to go back to what the founding fathers meant by the Constitution that it would mean the end to Social Security, Medicare, public schools and the military. I wonder if they have actually listened to this nutcase out in Nevada or to Rand Paul or even to Sarah Palin for anything more than the buzz words.

They say they only want what the Constitution authorizes and if it isn't authorized by the Constitution, it should be dismantled. The Constitution not only does not authorize a standing military, but implictly says we are NOT to have one. It does not authorize public schools. It does not authorize Social Security or Medicare. It does not authorize the collection of taxes for the many purposes that we now collect taxes.

Be careful what you wish for. You might just get it. Unfortunately, the rest of us will be stuck with it too just like the people that were smart enough to listen to Hitler instead of just hearing his buzz words.

[Dale escondido]

Its tea party not baggers first off.
Destroying logic and insults are the lefts only tools in their box.
You seem to support absolute government and insult those who would liike a little common sense applied.
I went to one tea party event and think it will just be hyjacked by the gop.
But the people genuinly are looking for answers to problems the government wants to label as to big to solve.
Believing the US is invincible to the effects of bad fiscal policy is lame.
Its true Obama inherited a mess of epic proportions.
Blaming bush is small minded as its been thirty or more years run up to this.
Bush was an awful president. But Obama may be the worst ever.
Building bigger government, bleeding jobs overseas, and open borders are a formula for the demise of America.

[kres24GT]

I wonder if those mindless sheep that are flocking to the Teabaggers are really listening to what they are saying or all they hear are the buzz words like "smaller government" . . . "lower taxes".

I wonder if they realize exactly how much smaller government these people are advocating? I wonder if they realize that when they say they want to go back to what the founding fathers meant by the Constitution that it would mean the end to Social Security, Medicare, public schools and the military. I wonder if they have actually listened to this nutcase out in Nevada or to Rand Paul or even to Sarah Palin for anything more than the buzz words.

They say they only want what the Constitution authorizes and if it isn't authorized by the Constitution, it should be dismantled. The Constitution not only does not authorize a standing military, but implictly says we are NOT to have one. It does not authorize public schools. It does not authorize Social Security or Medicare. It does not authorize the collection of taxes for the many purposes that we now collect taxes.

Be careful what you wish for. You might just get it. Unfortunately, the rest of us will be stuck with it too just like the people that were smart enough to listen to Hitler instead of just hearing his buzz words.


Not a Tea party supporter but I definitely advocate a constitutional government void of a huge federal military, social security, medicare, a federal dept of education, and many other powers the federal government has seized.


I have to give you credit though, at least you admit we are ignoring the Constitution, you are just OK with it. most will deny it. We should amend the Constitution if it needs changing, not ignore it.

[SortofLiberal]

Its tea party not baggers first off.
Destroying logic and insults are the lefts only tools in their box.
You seem to support absolute government and insult those who would liike a little common sense applied.
I went to one tea party event and think it will just be hyjacked by the gop.
But the people genuinly are looking for answers to problems the government wants to label as to big to solve.
Believing the US is invincible to the effects of bad fiscal policy is lame.
Its true Obama inherited a mess of epic proportions.
Blaming bush is small minded as its been thirty or more years run up to this.
Bush was an awful president. But Obama may be the worst ever.
Building bigger government, bleeding jobs overseas, and open borders are a formula for the demise of America.

Dale,

I am calling them what they called themselves in the beginning. It is not my fault they picked a name that is some kind of disgusting fratboy prank. They picked it, let them live with it.

I am all for common sense and that is why I do not support the Teabaggers or the Republican Party. However, I do not see where the Republican Party ends and the Teabaggers begin. From what I have seen, the Republican party has just gone back to where it was before it put on two absurd conventions before the 2000 and 2004 Presidential elections claiming to be an inclusive party. They have a brand that is tarnished, so they are changing their name. It is like the guy that has a restaurant that has been shut down because of people dying of food poison opening back up under a new name. Nothing has changed other than the name, but he thinks he can fool people into thinking it is the new and trendy place to go. And unfortunately, the American people are stupid enough to come back for another case of food poisoning.

I am all for common sense like taking care of working Americans instead of sending massive subsidy checks to major oil companies and major health insurance companies that are making record profits. Funny, Republicans will claim they have to cut off unemployment benefits that people paid for to reduce deficit spending, but will filibuster bills that try to stop subsidy checks to companies making record profits.

If we are going to stop unemployment checks that people paid insurance for, then why not stop Social Security checks and Medicare since the only argument you ever hear when liberals want means testing is that these people paid for it, so they are ENTITLED. Granted when they were paying, it had criteria that had to be met and was a safety net and not an entitlement so they paid next to nothing in while collecting insane amounts now, but for some reason it is acceptable that out of a $3.6 Trillion annual budge $2 Trillion of it goes to Social Security and Medicare, but you do not hear all those conservatives that get those deposits every month saying that we need to stop deficit spending when the money is going into their bank accounts.

Yes, I am for common sense and common sense would tell you that if a person has adequate income to live on, they do not need or deserve a Social Security check. Yes, I am for common sense which tells me that people that have two or three private insurance plans do not need the taxpayers paying for their medical bills. You do realize that Medicare is ALWAYS primary. Do you realize that everyone that is retired from the military, state governments or federal governments have private insurance that taxpayers pay for along with Medicare that is paid for by taxpayers. My father is retired military, retired state employee and is over 65, so has Medicare. Taxpayers are paying for three separate insurance coverages for him and I don't know about you, but I find this unacceptable. So, yes, I believe in common sense and would say this is one area that we need to see cuts, but you never will.

We will never do anything that upsets seniors in this country because they control 77% of the wealth. We will continue to abuse those least able to stand up for themselves like those out of work and try to convince people that it is a stand against deficit spending while waving around the Bible and claiming to be a Christian nation, but my Bible says, "As you do unto the least of these. You do unto Me (Christ)". So much for the Christian nation and since it is the conservatives that put big business and the rich ahead of everyone and everything, I would say there is a problem with their claim to be Christian.

[Dale escondido]

Dale,

I am calling them what they called themselves in the beginning. It is not my fault they picked a name that is some kind of disgusting fratboy prank. They picked it, let them live with it.

I am all for common sense and that is why I do not support the Teabaggers or the Republican Party. However, I do not see where the Republican Party ends and the Teabaggers begin. From what I have seen, the Republican party has just gone back to where it was before it put on two absurd conventions before the 2000 and 2004 Presidential elections claiming to be an inclusive party. They have a brand that is tarnished, so they are changing their name. It is like the guy that has a restaurant that has been shut down because of people dying of food poison opening back up under a new name. Nothing has changed other than the name, but he thinks he can fool people into thinking it is the new and trendy place to go. And unfortunately, the American people are stupid enough to come back for another case of food poisoning.

I am all for common sense like taking care of working Americans instead of sending massive subsidy checks to major oil companies and major health insurance companies that are making record profits. Funny, Republicans will claim they have to cut off unemployment benefits that people paid for to reduce deficit spending, but will filibuster bills that try to stop subsidy checks to companies making record profits.

If we are going to stop unemployment checks that people paid insurance for, then why not stop Social Security checks and Medicare since the only argument you ever hear when liberals want means testing is that these people paid for it, so they are ENTITLED. Granted when they were paying, it had criteria that had to be met and was a safety net and not an entitlement so they paid next to nothing in while collecting insane amounts now, but for some reason it is acceptable that out of a $3.6 Trillion annual budge $2 Trillion of it goes to Social Security and Medicare, but you do not hear all those conservatives that get those deposits every month saying that we need to stop deficit spending when the money is going into their bank accounts.

Yes, I am for common sense and common sense would tell you that if a person has adequate income to live on, they do not need or deserve a Social Security check. Yes, I am for common sense which tells me that people that have two or three private insurance plans do not need the taxpayers paying for their medical bills. You do realize that Medicare is ALWAYS primary. Do you realize that everyone that is retired from the military, state governments or federal governments have private insurance that taxpayers pay for along with Medicare that is paid for by taxpayers. My father is retired military, retired state employee and is over 65, so has Medicare. Taxpayers are paying for three separate insurance coverages for him and I don't know about you, but I find this unacceptable. So, yes, I believe in common sense and would say this is one area that we need to see cuts, but you never will.

We will never do anything that upsets seniors in this country because they control 77% of the wealth. We will continue to abuse those least able to stand up for themselves like those out of work and try to convince people that it is a stand against deficit spending while waving around the Bible and claiming to be a Christian nation, but my Bible says, "As you do unto the least of these. You do unto Me (Christ)". So much for the Christian nation and since it is the conservatives that put big business and the rich ahead of everyone and everything, I would say there is a problem with their claim to be Christian.

Thanks for the civil response.
I think social security is like the wars we start, were stuck with them.
There were so many considerations not looked at, at the time, but the fact that its always been raided through the years brought the problem on sooner.
You make some very good points here.
I also believe government employment should be a job like the private sector and not a ticket to easy street at 50.
I will never defend the republican party ever.
History may have shown some better fiscal restraint from the dems in the past but that is history now.
Only when the lobbyist are castrated and the government see the people welfare as their job will we even have a chance.
I hate poverty and believe it is the cause of almost all of the worlds woes.
I believe we have lost representive government but still cling to the belief we are one election away from better.

[John Galt]

I believe we have lost representive government but still cling to the belief we are one election away from better.
And that just about sums it up.

WE have lost rep. govt....corporations have not.


To SOL's point....people do not pay for unemployment....employers do.

The feds were funding the state insurance funds, to keep people off of soup lines.

[Dale escondido]

And that just about sums it up.

WE have lost rep. govt....corporations have not.


To SOL's point....people do not pay for unemployment....employers do.

The feds were funding the state insurance funds, to keep people off of soup lines.

Yeah , it is actually simple to understand but not to repair.
Trying to find leaders who aren't owned or easily bought after elected is the challenge.

[MintJulep]

Yeah , it is actually simple to understand but not to repair.
Trying to find leaders who aren't owned or easily bought after elected is the challenge.They don't exist. It's called the human condition.

[John Galt]

They don't exist. It's called the human condition.
The quickest fix, is the do away with the current campaign finance structure.

Television spots should be replaced with debates. The airtime should be provided at no charge, and a tax credit issued to the networks for the time allotted.


Any viable candidate should be included in the debates, until local primaries eliminate them.


When we eliminate the need for millions of dollars to run a campaign, we eliminate the need for lobbyists' money.


It's a giant first step, that we'll never see.

[Dale escondido]

The quickest fix, is the do away with the current campaign finance structure.

Television spots should be replaced with debates. The airtime should be provided at no charge, and a tax credit issued to the networks for the time alotted.


Any viable candidate should be included in the debates, until local primaries eliminate them.


When we eliminate the need for millions of dollars to run a campaign, we eliminate the need for lobbyists' money.


It's a giant first step, that we'll never see.

I like it, a few rules to keep it real but no party money or filibustering of time.
One of the hundreds of cable channels dedicated to this.

[SortofLiberal]

Not a Tea party supporter but I definitely advocate a constitutional government void of a huge federal military, social security, medicare, a federal dept of education, and many other powers the federal government has seized.


I have to give you credit though, at least you admit we are ignoring the Constitution, you are just OK with it. most will deny it. We should amend the Constitution if it needs changing, not ignore it.


Kres,

I didn't say that I was ok with it. I just realize that the bulk of those that are pro-teabaggers are seniors and it is my guess that they will be in for a big surprise when that SS check stops coming and they go to the doctor and payment is expected upon services rendered because the Medicare card isn't valid any longer.

I have put out many posts on the need to get rich old farts off the backs of working families. Unlike conservatives, when I say that people should pay their own way (when they have the means), I don't say everyone other than those that cost the taxpayers $2 Trillion a year in spite of controlling 77% of the wealth in this country. No, Darling, you have definitely mistaken me for someone else if you think I am ok with such stupidity.

I do think if we are going to CLAIM to be a Christian nation and demand that the Ten Commandments be displayed and that children should be influenced by Christian prayer in schools that we should feel the obligation that Christ demanded of taking care of those that can't take care of themselves and have SS as a safety net, but if conservatives are going to admit that we are not a Christian nation, then I have no problem with getting rid of even that. I will make sure no one in my family goes hungry and if all other Americans would do the same, we would not NEED such safety nets and that process worked until the parents of the "Greatest Generation" were freezing to death because they didn't have money to pay the heat bill and were eating cat food because they could not afford the more expensive people food, so SS became an entitlement so "the Greatest Generation" would not have to be bothered with taking care of Grandma.

I am all for individual's taking care of themselves and keeping the government out of people's private lives. I hear conservatives talk a lot about this, but then they want to dictate who can get a marriage license and who's religion should be advocated in public schools.

See, I would make a perfect conservative if they just lived what they preach. I am all for fiscal responsibility, but it seems the only time that conservatives believe in fiscal responsibility is when the liberals have their hands on the national checkbook. I am all for those that were fortunate enough to live the American Dream using their money in their old age instead of banking theirs and living off the sweat of hard working American kids. I am all for capitalism, but don't have industries that have a monopoly like the health insurance companies in each state and call the rising costs supply and demand when they have no competition. I am all for those with private insurance using that policy before the taxpayer get stuck paying their bills, so insurance companies do not do anything other than collect premiums on all those that have private policies, but are over 65.

I could see cuts in the defense budget, but I think it would be a bit unwise to expect those militia's to protect us from being taken over by the Russians or the Chinese. I think with our without Constitution legitimacy, a standing military is a nessessity as this point.

Public schools as they are today are a waste of money. We have adults in the system that are just there for a paycheck and the security of tenure. They like to blame the parents and whine about how hard their jobs are, but truth be told if they would spend ALL their time being adults instead of flipping back and forth from the kids' buddies one day and the Big Bad Teacher the next, they would be able to keep control of their classrooms, but you can't tell your 6th grade class about the goodies you found at Victoria's Secret on Friday and then send them all to the office on Monday for "disrespect" when they ask you how the weekend went.

Yes, we have things that are not SPECIFICALLY detailed in the Constitution, but then again, we have a world that none of our founding fathers could have ever imagined. So, since Ben Franklin did not know about space travel, should we do away with NASA. Thomas Jefferson didn't know about commercial airlines, so should we do away with the FAA and the NTSB?

I would say the genie is out of the bottle and this absurd idea that we CAN go back to the country as our founding father's wrote it is insane, but conservatives are falling for the teabagger's propaganda and it is just as dangerous for our nation as the German's falling for Hitler's was for Germany.

[kres24GT]

And that just about sums it up.

WE have lost rep. govt....corporations have not.


To SOL's point....people do not pay for unemployment....employers do.

The feds were funding the state insurance funds, to keep people off of soup lines.


Bingo. Exactly why it is insane to not be for smaller government.

[kres24GT]

Kres,

I didn't say that I was ok with it. I just realize that the bulk of those that are pro-teabaggers are seniors and it is my guess that they will be in for a big surprise when that SS check stops coming and they go to the doctor and payment is expected upon services rendered because the Medicare card isn't valid any longer.

I have put out many posts on the need to get rich old farts off the backs of working families. Unlike conservatives, when I say that people should pay their own way (when they have the means), I don't say everyone other than those that cost the taxpayers $2 Trillion a year in spite of controlling 77% of the wealth in this country. No, Darling, you have definitely mistaken me for someone else if you think I am ok with such stupidity.

I do think if we are going to CLAIM to be a Christian nation and demand that the Ten Commandments be displayed and that children should be influenced by Christian prayer in schools that we should feel the obligation that Christ demanded of taking care of those that can't take care of themselves and have SS as a safety net, but if conservatives are going to admit that we are not a Christian nation, then I have no problem with getting rid of even that. I will make sure no one in my family goes hungry and if all other Americans would do the same, we would not NEED such safety nets and that process worked until the parents of the "Greatest Generation" were freezing to death because they didn't have money to pay the heat bill and were eating cat food because they could not afford the more expensive people food, so SS became an entitlement so "the Greatest Generation" would not have to be bothered with taking care of Grandma.

I am all for individual's taking care of themselves and keeping the government out of people's private lives. I hear conservatives talk a lot about this, but then they want to dictate who can get a marriage license and who's religion should be advocated in public schools.

See, I would make a perfect conservative if they just lived what they preach. I am all for fiscal responsibility, but it seems the only time that conservatives believe in fiscal responsibility is when the liberals have their hands on the national checkbook. I am all for those that were fortunate enough to live the American Dream using their money in their old age instead of banking theirs and living off the sweat of hard working American kids. I am all for capitalism, but don't have industries that have a monopoly like the health insurance companies in each state and call the rising costs supply and demand when they have no competition. I am all for those with private insurance using that policy before the taxpayer get stuck paying their bills, so insurance companies do not do anything other than collect premiums on all those that have private policies, but are over 65.

I could see cuts in the defense budget, but I think it would be a bit unwise to expect those militia's to protect us from being taken over by the Russians or the Chinese. I think with our without Constitution legitimacy, a standing military is a nessessity as this point.

Public schools as they are today are a waste of money. We have adults in the system that are just there for a paycheck and the security of tenure. They like to blame the parents and whine about how hard their jobs are, but truth be told if they would spend ALL their time being adults instead of flipping back and forth from the kids' buddies one day and the Big Bad Teacher the next, they would be able to keep control of their classrooms, but you can't tell your 6th grade class about the goodies you found at Victoria's Secret on Friday and then send them all to the office on Monday for "disrespect" when they ask you how the weekend went.

Yes, we have things that are not SPECIFICALLY detailed in the Constitution, but then again, we have a world that none of our founding fathers could have ever imagined. So, since Ben Franklin did not know about space travel, should we do away with NASA. Thomas Jefferson didn't know about commercial airlines, so should we do away with the FAA and the NTSB?

I would say the genie is out of the bottle and this absurd idea that we CAN go back to the country as our founding father's wrote it is insane, but conservatives are falling for the teabagger's propaganda and it is just as dangerous for our nation as the German's falling for Hitler's was for Germany.


This is not a Christian nation, fuck the poor. Be responsible for you and yours, and if you so choose, help others. Fuck corporate handouts and bailouts as well.

Military cuts are a definite necessity, our defense budget is unbelievable bloated, thanks in part to back room deals.

Doesn't matter that they founding fathers could not envision today's world, that is why they gave us the ability to amend it. You think the Constitution doesn't cover something that it needs to, pass an amendment. Don't just ignore it.

I think we are right at the point of no return. We have reached the point where we start systematically breaking down the federal government to its Constitutional roots, or we scrap it and welcome the police state.

[Bill Cosby]

The quickest fix, is the do away with the current campaign finance structure.

Television spots should be replaced with debates. The airtime should be provided at no charge, and a tax credit issued to the networks for the time allotted.


Any viable candidate should be included in the debates, until local primaries eliminate them.


When we eliminate the need for millions of dollars to run a campaign, we eliminate the need for lobbyists' money.


It's a giant first step, that we'll never see.
:talktothehand: :talktothehand: :talktothehand:

Hold on now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

That is just way, way, way to radical & unprofitable........... You know how much they make on those campaign ads??? ChaCHING!!!!!!!

& do you really wanna take a chance that someone unpopular w/ the military industrial complex/wallstreet/insurance/pharm get in there & disturb our "way of life"????????????

Our dumbOcratic system of selecting between two candidates of their choosing/liking has worked fine for our ancestors so why risk change???

Open debates?? Where no bodies like us could actually debate w/ a dem or a repub??? Unheard of & frankly outrageous.......... Are we to become like those lesser democracies w/ much more direct forms of participation??

:lmao2:

[Bill Cosby]

I didn't say that I was ok with it. I just realize that the bulk of those that are pro-teabaggers are seniors and it is my guess that they will be in for a big surprise when that SS check stops coming and they go to the doctor and payment is expected upon services rendered because the Medicare card isn't valid any longer.

This is one of the issues I have w/ that movement......... Many are older & yet they believe they are entitled to those (socialist) services because they, unlike everyone, has earned them.....

The fact that they are getting back far more than they put in is irrelevant & is excused & rationalized away........ "I EARNED THIS:mad: "...............

They scream that others be cut off, cause they did not earn it........ If someone works forty years & gets laid off & lose their benefits=tuff shit.....

So I think they see themselves, in a sense, the lucky ones, the privileged, the blessed or whatever, but in a survival of the fittest kinda way.. I got mine, I made it (often ignoring their silver spoon) I am a memeber of the priviledged class.................

Now gimmie my checks, police protection & military power & tax break I tee off in an hour.......:thumbsup:

[kres24GT]

I have no problem telling those who paid int o SS "tough shit". That is what they get for allowing government to take their money.