Terrorist nuclear attack victims must wait 24-72 hours for federal emergency help

[Smurf-Herder]

I thought we had 14,000 emergency responders, ready to be flown to the location of a WMD attack, that have been training and having nationwide drills for this exact scenario for the past few years..

Nuclear blast victims would have to wait
By Steve Sternberg, USA TODAY

The White House has warned state and local governments not to expect a "significant federal response" at the scene of a terrorist nuclear attack for 24 to 72 hours after the blast, according to a planning guide.

President Obama told delegates from 47 nations at the Nuclear Security Summit on Tuesday that it would be a "catastrophe for the world" if al-Qaeda or another terrorist group got a nuclear device, because so many lives would be lost and it would be so hard to mitigate damage from the blast.

A 10-kiloton nuclear explosion would level buildings within half a mile of ground zero, generate 900-mph winds, bathe the landscape with radiation and produce a plume of fallout that would drift for hundreds of miles, the guide says. It was posted on the Internet and sent to local officials.

The document is designed to help local officials craft plans for responding to a nuclear blast. The prospect is anything but far-fetched, says Rick Nelson of the Center for Strategic and International Studies. "Do I think in my lifetime I'll see the detonation of a nuclear device? I do."

One challenge he says, will be to persuade survivors to stay indoors, shielded from dangerous radiation until they're given the all-clear or told to evacuate. "In all likelihood, families will be separated," he says. "It's going to be scary to sit tight, though it's the right thing to do."

The government's planning scenarios envision a terrorist strike in an urban area with a 10-kiloton device, slightly smaller than the roughly 15-kiloton Hiroshima bomb. A 10-kiloton device packs the punch of 10,000 tons of TNT.

The chaos that would inevitably follow such a blast would make it difficult for the federal government to react quickly. "Emergency response is principally a local function," the document says, though "federal assistance will be mobilized as rapidly as possible."

The "Planning Guidance for Response to a Nuclear Detonation" was developed by a task force headed by the White House Homeland Security Council. It was circulated to state and local government officials and first responders in January 2009.

The report has never been formally released to the public, White House spokesman Nick Shapiro says.

It offers practical guidance to first responders and advice on radiation measurement and decontamination.

Disaster experts say local governments aren't prepared for a nuclear attack. "There isn't a single American city, in my estimation, that has sufficient plans for a nuclear terrorist event," says Irwin Redlener of Columbia University's Mailman School of Public Health.

The message for families is simple, he says: Stay put. Wait for instructions. If you've been outside, dust off, change, shower. "What citizens need to know fits on a wallet-sized card," Redlener says. "A limited amount of information would save tens of thousands of people."

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2010-04-13-nuke-plans_N.htm

Take note of this: "Stay put. Wait for instructions. If you've been outside, dust off, change, shower."

Wihin a few miles of a nuclear detonation, there will be no electricity and the pulse will knock out any electronics in telecommunication devices - no TV, radio, Internet or phone service. And IF the water is running, at a certain point people will be showering in contaminated water.

In other words, you're ass is grass if you're caught outdoors. But the feds will be along at some point, to help those who were smart enough to make it to the edge of the quarantine zone, before they died of radiation poisoning.

And if you're indoors, you'd better have tons of duct tape and enough (non-refrigerated) food to last you until someone gets to your door - assuming (yeah, right) that they have enough people to knock on every door. So after three days, expect responders to start knocking on tens of thousands of doors - starting from the edge of the contaminated area (which could cover hundreds of square miles).

[doctordog]

And the democrats complained and whined about Katrina victims that had 7 days notice to get the fuck out.

[Hawkeye2j]

And the democrats complained and whined about Katrina victims that had 7 days notice to get the fuck out.
This is designed to get local governments to prepare. Locals are not prepared now. The report shows what would happen Federally, not locally. It is a common sense report.

[foxbaron]

This is designed to get local governments to prepare. Locals are not prepared now. The report shows what would happen Federally, not locally. It is a common sense report.


Local governments don't have the money nor the personnel.

The truth is that the feds will quarantine the area and let all those inside die.

[Smurf-Herder]

This is designed to get local governments to prepare. Locals are not prepared now. The report shows what would happen Federally, not locally. It is a common sense report.

But the feds have been training for rapid deployment of WMD responders for nearly a decade. What will the local government do once destroyed in a nuclear blast? This is probably the one type of disaster that the feds and FEMA are fully equiped to handle, supposedly. In fact, the feds are probably the only ones that have the type of equipment and resources primarily designed for responding to a nuclear attack - considering we're talking about an act of war, as opposed to a hurricane or earthquake.

[MintJulep]

And the democrats complained and whined about Katrina victims that had 7 days notice to get the fuck out.:lmao2: :lmao2:

[T-Cat]

And the democrats complained and whined about Katrina victims that had 7 days notice to get the fuck out.What has this to do with the Democrats in particular?

[doctordog]

What has this to do with the Democrats in particular?

Damn is this stupid night?

Here is the first line in the first post:

The White House has warned state and local governments not to expect a "significant federal response" at the scene of a terrorist nuclear attack for 24 to 72 hours after the blast, according to a planning guide.

Who is in the White House? A republican, no a democrat. DUH:disbelief:

[T-Cat]

Damn is this stupid night?

Here is the first line in the first post:

The White House has warned state and local governments not to expect a "significant federal response" at the scene of a terrorist nuclear attack for 24 to 72 hours after the blast, according to a planning guide.

Who is in the White House? A republican, no a democrat. DUH:disbelief:It is always stupid night for you wayers.

You really can't read a whole article can you?

The "Planning Guidance for Response to a Nuclear Detonation" was developed by a task force headed by the White House Homeland Security Council. It was circulated to state and local government officials and first responders in January 2009.And if you look at the edition date of the guide it is January 16, 2009

Who was president on January 16, 2009?

Quite frankly it doesn't sound like a crazy assumption to figure it would take at least 24 hours for a significant federal response to arrive. If you read the document itself they discuss such things in more detail:

The guidance is aimed at response activities in an environment with a severly compromised infastructure for the first few days (e.g. 24-72 hours) when it is likely that many Federal resources will still be en route to the incident.

[doctordog]

It is always stupid night for you wayers.

You really can't read a whole article can you?

And if you look at the edition date of the guide it is January 16, 2009

Who was president on January 16, 2009?

The statement came out of the "existing administration", take your dumbass back the echo chamber where you are respected.:lmao2:

[T-Cat]

The statement came out of the "existing administration", take your dumbass back the echo chamber where you are respected.:lmao2:Please demostrate where it says it came out of the "existing administration".

And the guide was produced by Bush's Homeland Security Council, not Obama's. The 24 to 72 hour wait for significant Federal response are figures from the Bush administration.

Try again dumbass.

[doctordog]

Please demostrate where it says it came out of the "existing administration".

And the guide was produced by Bush's Homeland Security Council, not Obama's. The 24 to 72 hour wait for significant Federal response are figures from the Bush administration.

Try again dumbass.

OMFG!:lmao2:

It came out yesterday, there is even a picture of Obama with the story! You do know how to click on link that is listed with the story right?

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2010-04-13-nuke-plans_N.htm

ROFLMFAO!:lmao2:

[Smurf-Herder]

Please demostrate where it says it came out of the "existing administration".

And the guide was produced by Bush's Homeland Security Council, not Obama's. The 24 to 72 hour wait for significant Federal response are figures from the Bush administration.

Try again dumbass.

In my view, it doesn't matter if it's Bush or Obama. The feds have had years to prep for this. The military has transport planes to fly into the nearest available airfield. We can all assume the targets would more than likely be DC, NY, or possibly LA. It shouldn't take the military and FEMA more than a few hours to start getting decontamination, firefighting and medical equipment into the area. It's just a question of how immense the task is once they get there. But after years of preparation, you'd think substantial resources would start moving in, in less than 24 hours ......... let alone 72.

[T-Cat]

OMFG!:lmao2:

It came out yesterday, there is even a picture of Obama with the story! You do know how to click on link that is listed with the story right?

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2010-04-13-nuke-plans_N.htm

ROFLMFAO!:lmao2:You braindead fool. The story came out yesterday, the planning guide came out in January 2009.

I'll put it together for your incredibly limited dog brain.

First Part:

The White House has warned state and local governments not to expect a "significant federal response" at the scene of a terrorist nuclear attack for 24 to 72 hours after the blast, according to a planning guide.
Second Part:

The "Planning Guidance for Response to a Nuclear Detonation" was developed by a task force headed by the White House Homeland Security Council. It was circulated to state and local government officials and first responders in January 2009.

Now click on the link to the ACTUAL PLANNING GUIDE and look at the date:

January 16, 2009

[mrmeangenes]

Those little details have a way of jumping out at you, right Wayers ??

http://i468.photobucket.com/albums/rr50/mrmeangenes/th_snake_bite.jpg (http://s468.photobucket.com/albums/rr50/mrmeangenes/?action=view&current=snake_bite.jpg)

[T-Cat]

In my view, it doesn't matter if it's Bush or Obama.I don't disagree. It was of course wayers who made it partisan.

The feds have had years to prep for this. The military has transport planes to fly into the nearest available airfield. We can all assume the targets would more than likely be DC, NY, or possibly LA. It shouldn't take the military and FEMA more than a few hours to start getting decontamination, firefighting and medical equipment into the area. It's just a question of how immense the task is once they get there. But after years of preparation, you'd think substantial resources would start moving in, in less than 24 hours ......... let alone 72.I am sure they would have started moving in less than 24 hours. But be realistic, a nuclear blast is going to disrupt a lot of things and make transportion into the region very difficult. Which is why I quoted this part of the report in a post above:

The guidance is aimed at response activities in an environment with a severly compromised infastructure for the first few days (e.g. 24-72 hours) when it is likely that many Federal resources will still be en route to the incident.I think it is a realistic warning. You can't just rush a pile of people and equipment into a dangerous radiation zone with dubious infastructure, you could endanger even more people.

[doctordog]

You braindead fool. The story came out yesterday, the planning guide came out in January 2009.

I'll put it together for your incredibly limited dog brain.

First Part:


Second Part:



Now click on the link to the ACTUAL PLANNING GUIDE and look at the date:

January 16, 2009

Regardless, only Obama felt weak enough to put the message out, I mean after all until this job his biggest resume point was community organizer.:lmao2:

[T-Cat]

Regardless,of how much of a moron you are...

only Obama felt weak enough to put the message out, I mean after all until this job his biggest resume point was community organizer.:lmao2:You can't stop looking like a fool can you. Obama didn't put the message out. Nobody actually "put the message out". It was a Homeland Security document produced by the Bush administration specifically designated for state, local, and first responders. It wasn't formally released to the public.

[doctordog]

of how much of a moron you are...

You can't stop looking like a fool can you. Obama didn't put the message out. Nobody actually "put the message out". It was a Homeland Security document produced by the Bush administration specifically designated for state, local, and first responders. It wasn't formally released to the public.

Exactly, the public had no knowledge of it until yesterday. Since you like name calling like most liberals just run along asswipe.:thumbsup:

[Hawkeye2j]

The statement came out of the "existing administration", take your dumbass back the echo chamber where you are respected.:lmao2:

To explain it further, Bush was President when the report was put together. And it is a common sense report.

[Smurf-Herder]

I don't disagree. It was of course wayers who made it partisan.

I am sure they would have started moving in less than 24 hours. But be realistic, a nuclear blast is going to disrupt a lot of things and make transportion into the region very difficult. Which is why I quoted this part of the report in a post above:

I think it is a realistic warning. You can't just rush a pile of people and equipment into a dangerous radiation zone with dubious infastructure, you could endanger even more people.

I'm thinking in terms of the nearest airports, which won't be physically damaged. With transport planes, BCN protected tracked vehicles, helicopters, etc. We have all this stuff; and they've been training for years. Rapid deployment is essential for saving lives in radioactive environments. The locals won't have the ability to do this like the US military can, or as fast as they can. Because they'll have to use the infrastructure, while the military can come in from the outside by air.

[T-Cat]

Exactly, the public had no knowledge of it until yesterday.That is probably a bad assumption to make. Considering the number of people involved in various levels of state and local governments and the number of first responders, I'm sure that quite a few of the public knew about it.

Since you like name calling like most liberals just run along asswipe.:thumbsup:Since you started the name calling and insults and then proceeded to demonstrate what a moron you are who can't read why don't you run along asswipe.

[doctordog]

That is probably a bad assumption to make. Considering the number of people involved in various levels of state and local governments and the number of first responders, I'm sure that quite a few of the public knew about it.

Since you started the name calling and insults and then proceeded to demonstrate what a moron you are who can't read why don't you run along asswipe.

:lmao2: :lmao2: more asshat name calling, keep them coming.

[T-Cat]

I'm thinking in terms of the nearest airports, which won't be physically damaged.What about the fallout and the wind direction? Landing at the airport could be unsafe for the next 12-36+ hours.

With transport planes, BCN protected tracked vehicles, helicopters, etc. We have all this stuff; and they've been training for years. Rapid deployment is essential for saving lives in radioactive environments. The locals won't have the ability to do this like the US military can, or as fast as they can. Because they'll have to use the infrastructure, while the military can come in from the outside by air.Even if they get to a nearby airport, moving into the blast zone where most of the injured people are might be difficult depending on the damage to the infastructure. Remember they said "significant" response. The response would have to be huge, in the thousands, for it to be significant.

[T-Cat]

:lmao2: :lmao2: more asshat name calling, keep them coming.You keep starting with the insults doggie, and that's what you get. Poor baby.

[doctordog]

You keep starting with the insults doggie, and that's what you get. Poor baby.

You are the only whining mIchele.:taunt:

[T-Cat]

You are the only whining mIchele.:taunt:Oh poor doggie, gets his sorry little mug smacked around and then he complains about liberals doing name calling when he was the one who started it. Not just a whiner, but a hypocrite about it. :lmao2:

[Smurf-Herder]

What about the fallout and the wind direction? Landing at the airport could be unsafe for the next 12-36+ hours.

Even if they get to a nearby airport, moving into the blast zone where most of the injured people are might be difficult depending on the damage to the infastructure. Remember they said "significant" response. The response would have to be huge, in the thousands, for it to be significant.

If you're wearing protective gear, landing is no problem - remember, nobody else will be.

Then those injured people are as good as dead.

[T-Cat]

If you're wearing protective gear, landing is no problem - remember, nobody else will be. Then those injured people are as good as dead.You still have the heavily damaged infastructure problem to deal with. It could depend heavily on the size and location of the blast. Can you imagine some place like Manhattan island. A large blast could take a lot of the bridges and/or leave many unusable. The freeways would be in shambles, and you'd have hundreds of huge buildings on fire not to mention the debris from the collapsed ones. Getting a large force in from the outside in under 24 hours would probably be an amazing feet.

I'm not saying you wouldn't want a faster response, but I think it is good advice to first responders etc. not to expect a large federal effort to be there that quickly.

[Smurf-Herder]

You still have the heavily damaged infastructure problem to deal with. It could depend heavily on the size and location of the blast. Can you imagine some place like Manhattan island. A large blast could take a lot of the bridges and/or leave many unusable. The freeways would be in shambles, and you'd have hundreds of huge buildings on fire not to mention the debris from the collapsed ones. Getting a large force in from the outside in under 24 hours would probably be an amazing feet.

I'm not saying you wouldn't want a faster response, but I think it is good advice to first responders etc. not to expect a large federal effort to be there that quickly.

If you're talking about a 10kt device, you're only talking about an area a few miles in diameter. The remainder of the area, the larger effected area, would just be contamination from fallout. I don't see why those outer areas away from ground zero couldn't be gotten to in a short period of time, with helicopters, tracked vehicles, or even regular vehicles on the periphery.

[T-Cat]

If you're talking about a 10kt device, you're only talking about an area a few miles in diameter.Manhattan island, at its maximum, is only about 2.5 miles wide.

The remainder of the area, the larger effected area, would just be contamination from fallout. I don't see why those outer areas away from ground zero couldn't be gotten to in a short period of time, with helicopters, tracked vehicles, or even regular vehicles on the periphery.Your probably right about the outer areas, depending on the location. Keep in mind though that this guide is specifically for local governments and first responders, giving them information on what to expect and what to do if there is a nuclear blast. I don't see anything wrong with warning them that a significant federal response won't be there for 1 to 3 days. They need to start operations and help a lot of people within just a few hours to be effective.

[Smurf-Herder]

Manhattan island, at its maximum, is only about 2.5 miles wide.

Your probably right about the outer areas, depending on the location. Keep in mind though that this guide is specifically for local governments and first responders, giving them information on what to expect and what to do if there is a nuclear blast. I don't see anything wrong with warning them that a significant federal response won't be there for 1 to 3 days. They need to start operations and help a lot of people within just a few hours to be effective.

An island can be accessed from the sea.

But I do understand your point. I just hope the feds have their act together and have a rapid response capable of getting in there sooner.

[T-Cat]

An island can be accessed from the sea.

But I do understand your point. I just hope the feds have their act together and have a rapid response capable of getting in there sooner.I would hope so too. Hope more than expect. Can you imagine the chaos? In a place like New York or any other big city, you'd have millions of people in the surrounding areas panicing because of the radiation cloud, clogging roads and who knows what.

[mwillman]

An island can be accessed from the sea.

What makes you say that?
I have seen many lakes with islands.

Anyway you can reach Manhattan from the sea, thats why they have a large port and the Statue Of liberty just off its shore.

[T-Cat]

What makes you say that?
I have seen many lakes with islands.

Anyway you can reach Manhattan from the sea, thats why they have a large port and the Statue Of liberty just off its shore.Kind of a silly thing to point out since I think most people are aware of that. Smurf meant it was accessable by water, and specifically by the sea in the case of Manhattan.

I know lots of islands within lakes. I can't think of any that would be a target for nuclear bomb terrorism.

[mwillman]

Kind of a silly thing to point out since I think most people are aware of that. Smurf meant it was accessable by water, and specifically by the sea in the case of Manhattan.

I know lots of islands within lakes. I can't think of any that would be a target for nuclear bomb terrorism.

Actually there are a few lakes with islands on them that would be the target of terrorism an obvious one being Chicago.

[T-Cat]

Actually there are a few lakes with islands on them that would be the target of terrorism an obvious one being Chicago.You consider Chicago to be on an island?