Spinning up Venus

[disrupter]

Venus has many agreeable attributes for humans & other Earth lifeforms.
Very similar size & mass as the Earth.
Not too much closer to the sun (not significantly hotter i don't believe)

It even has a molten core which Mars has lost.

The reason it doesn't have a protective magnetic field is simply because it doesn't spin fast enough.

So to get it ready for terraforming, how do we get Venus up to some nice rate of spin? [ideally near 24 earth hours] To get that magnetic field powered up.

If one dropped some hyper dense matter it might contract the planet making it spin faster. [tiny black-hole; neutron star matter]

Maybe adding a moon might help? [really stabbing in the dark on this one.]

One could play with gravitation & the fabric of space-time perhaps?

Or one could fire material at the circumferential edge to push it around.

If one did fire material, effectively parallel to the surface [nearly parallel to the circumference of spin at a high rate of speed, one might start with alkaline minerals, especially if it is somewhat too acid from the existing sulfur. Then as the atmosphere protecting magnetic field powered up one could fire up H20, CO2, N2, O2 & other necessary life sustaining organics.

I realize these might be hairbrained schemes for now,
but there may be some better more workable ideas for doing so,

and as a result you get something close to an Earth-2,
Which really does literally approach pricelessness.

So do you have any wild or coherent ideas for getting the job done?

[gOd]

A moon would only slow it down due to gravitational friction.

[disrupter]

What if it was going faster than Venus's current rate of spin?

Sort of leading & increasing the spin? Close in with a fast revolution to keep it from crashing into [falling on] the planet?

[disrupter]

Of course we have to watch out for the mis-calculation where it throws Venus out of its orbit & it crashes into Earth [or throws Earth out of its orbit], & OMG, lol.

got to think about these really carefully.

[gOd]

I think a tangential strike from a decent size asteroid might do it.

[Bill Cosby]

You guys playing pool w/ the planets???

Pluto in the side pocket............

http://kenoath.files.wordpress.com/2007/12/pluto-planet.jpg

http://ucommphoto.nmsu.edu/newsphoto/pluto_protest.jpg

[gOd]

Phuk Pluto!

[Bill Cosby]

I knew you were a pluto hater the second I saw that large gold orb...

Hey PlutO will be back just you watch...:lmao2: :lmao2:

I recall when I told my daughters it was no longer a planet (there first experiences @ learning not everything we are taught as fact is fact)...

They were in disbelief ~ "they can't do that", "of course Pluto is a planet", "that not right"...... Then of course poor Pluto, & pluto is so cute...... :lmao2:

They were young then.......

[Corgiluv]

I knew you were a pluto hater the second I saw that large gold orb...

Hey PlutO will be back just you watch...:lmao2: :lmao2:

I recall when I told my daughters it was no longer a planet (there first experiences @ learning not everything we are taught as fact is fact)...

They were in disbelief ~ "they can't do that", "of course Pluto is a planet", "that not right"...... Then of course poor Pluto, & pluto is so cute...... :lmao2:

They were young then.......


Protest for Pluto, LMAO!!

The lady with the sunglasses is looking at her husband and seems to say, "Marvin, tell me one more time, why are we here?"

[gOd]

I knew you were a pluto hater the second I saw that large gold orb...

Hey PlutO will be back just you watch...:lmao2: :lmao2:

I recall when I told my daughters it was no longer a planet (there first experiences @ learning not everything we are taught as fact is fact)...

They were in disbelief ~ "they can't do that", "of course Pluto is a planet", "that not right"...... Then of course poor Pluto, & pluto is so cute...... :lmao2:

They were young then.......Dude, when your moon is almost as big as you are, you're NOT a fucking planet. I cant's wait until it collides with Neptune so this whole nonsense will cease!

[Bill Cosby]

Protest for Pluto, LMAO!!

The lady with the sunglasses is looking at her husband and seems to say, "Marvin, tell me one more time, why are we here?"

Hey some ppl take their planets seriously.... :lmao2: :lmao2:

They are prob killing time till the star trek exhibit opened...lol

[CosmicRocker]

Pluto was thought to have been a large asteroid, captured by Neptunes gravity,
The idea that it's not a planet, is that it wasn't formed from the solar system but came from a differnt part of the universe, as the planets formed enough mass to capture it.
Least that's my understanding of why pluto is not a "planet'

[Bill Cosby]

Dude, when your moon is almost as big as you are, you're NOT a fucking planet. I cant's wait until it collides with Neptune so this whole nonsense will cease!

My moon???? Dude you keep your eyes off my moon.......lol

You're just a hater..... A Plutophobian.... :hi:

Good, decent & semi-employed/literate & occasionally tax paying Americans will see to Pluto's triumphant return???

You ppl got a agenda & it don't stop w/ Pluto....

What next, Neptune then gramma ... :mad:

The planets are like the constitution.......... We should just stick w/ it regardless if it makes sense or works...

:thumbsup:

:lmao2:

[Bill Cosby]

Pluto was thought to have been a large asteroid, captured by Neptunes gravity,
The idea that it's not a planet, is that it wasn't formed from the solar system but came from a differnt part of the universe, as the planets formed enough mass to capture it.
Least that's my understanding of why pluto is not a "planet'

That idea is a commie plot=conspiracy.... Pluto is different- straight up discrimination... & you know it..........

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_WsE6M_RjBIY/R15nOdnGjBI/AAAAAAAAFgU/CHjovonxPcc/s400/teenagers_from_uranus.jpg

[CosmicRocker]

That idea is a commie plot=conspiracy.... Pluto is different- straight up discrimination... & you know it..........

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_WsE6M_RjBIY/R15nOdnGjBI/AAAAAAAAFgU/CHjovonxPcc/s400/teenagers_from_uranus.jpgdamn commie Plutonians !! :thumbsup:

[disrupter]

So an 'official' planet can not be captured from elsewhere, it is required to be home-grown, no 'naturalization' allowed?

You people are anti-immigrant ;)

Obviously we need to lay down the rules & let the Universe know what our expectations of it are, after all we have standards to uphold.

[Environment Man]

Humans were intended to live on Earth.

Maybe visits to the other planets but they are uninhabitable for a reason.

God created Earth for his created humans to live on.

Venus has many agreeable attributes for humans & other Earth lifeforms.
Very similar size & mass as the Earth.
Not too much closer to the sun (not significantly hotter i don't believe)

Not significantly hotter? What planet are you living on?

We are worried about global warming here.

It is downright boiling there.

It even has a molten core which Mars has lost.

The reason it doesn't have a protective magnetic field is simply because it doesn't spin fast enough.

So to get it ready for terraforming, how do we get Venus up to some nice rate of spin? [ideally near 24 earth hours] To get that magnetic field powered up.

If one dropped some hyper dense matter it might contract the planet making it spin faster. [tiny black-hole; neutron star matter]

Hyper dense matter? What is that? And where would we get it from?

Maybe adding a moon might help? [really stabbing in the dark on this one.]

One could play with gravitation & the fabric of space-time perhaps?

How would we get a moon to put there? We still have trouble even travelling there.

We can't manipulate space-time.

Or one could fire material at the circumferential edge to push it around.

What material is this? It does not exist.

You should go into movie making for we can't even clean the air on Earth.

If one did fire material, effectively parallel to the surface [nearly parallel to the circumference of spin at a high rate of speed, one might start with alkaline minerals, especially if it is somewhat too acid from the existing sulfur. Then as the atmosphere protecting magnetic field powered up one could fire up H20, CO2, N2, O2 & other necessary life sustaining organics.

This is just nonsense. Humans do not have the capability to make Venus spin faster.

I realize these might be hairbrained schemes for now,
but there may be some better more workable ideas for doing so,

and as a result you get something close to an Earth-2,
Which really does literally approach pricelessness.

Okay. At least you know it is hairbrained.

The price of trying to do what you say would be better used better maintaining the earth.

So do you have any wild or coherent ideas for getting the job done?

Forget about it.

[CosmicRocker]

So an 'official' planet can not be captured from elsewhere, it is required to be home-grown, no 'naturalization' allowed?

You people are anti-immigrant ;)

Obviously we need to lay down the rules & let the Universe know what our expectations of it are, after all we have standards to uphold.
If it's a planet, it doesn't need a green card.
But if it's a "long term resident", we may have to check it's visa. :thumbsup:

[Bill Cosby]

So an 'official' planet can not be captured from elsewhere, it is required to be home-grown, no 'naturalization' allowed?

You people are anti-immigrant

Obviously we need to lay down the rules & let the Universe know what our expectations of it are, after all we have standards to uphold.

:lmao2:

:thumbsup:

Great points.... lol

I have heard that our moon is the result of a collision of earth w/ another body a foreign one~ thus an unholy & unsanctioned union...

Perhaps we need to consider deporting that illegal moon.... I was always suspicious about the moon since I found out they were lying about that cheese...

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_wnWrnQkOUJI/SmzUCIupbyI/AAAAAAAAAcU/lO5xXjbQseQ/s400/cat-women-of-the-moon-posters.jpg

http://www.saisathyasai.com/baba/man-in-the-moon-3.jpg

[Bill Cosby]

If it's a planet, it doesn't need a green card.
But if it's a "long term resident", we may have to check it's visa. :thumbsup:

You damn liberals are always so accommidating to illegals..

No healthcare for 5 years

All back taxes paid in full + SSI, workmens comp & tolls...

Skip rope & rotate now on it's axis just to prove loyalty... :thumbsup:

Not much to ask...

[disrupter]

I think a tangential strike from a decent size asteroid might do it.

This might be one of the more sensible ideas.

Both Earth & Mars at various times had encounters & ultimate collisions with 'moon' category sized rocks/objects.
The high speed death spiral between two intercircling objects/rocks/planets may be why both Earth & Mars spin on about a 24 hour cycle.
[might be informative if scientists could determine if Mars had its current spin before the object it was involved with actually crashed into it, or otherwise how & when that happened.]

Since there isn't much to preserve on the current surface of Venus, while a binary circling spin object sounds radical it might be the most pragmatic & workable, provided we understood all the expected results & designed it correctly. Then one could supply most the organics from crashing low density comets into it afterwards.

That temporary encircling object around [the relatively smaller] Mars is also what is credited by some with moltenizing its core, because of the tidal pressure & friction.

Our own moon's tidal effects may be contributing to the energy/friction to keep our own Earth's core molten.

Getting a distant [moon-sized?] object way early in its orbit one may be able to just nudge its trajectory just enough so that it entangles with Venus, without of course disturbing Earth [or anything else significant] in the process.

Just like keeping an asteroid from hitting the Earth is best done by very small adjustments in that object's path way ahead of intersection,
the converse of using that same strategy to get something to encircle & perhaps crash into Venus might apply. One would be talking about a much bigger object encircling/crashing into Venus, although perhaps a well planned series of smaller objects might work, & perhaps work even better.

We could do small objects first to learn the art/skill/science of it, then go on to larger ones to complete that task.
Then finish the job using comets to get the right surface chemistry/chemicals [H20, CO2, N2, O2]. Of course they could come in other forms like ammonia NH3, methane CH4 etc.

[gOd]

This might be one of the more sensible ideas.

Both Earth & Mars at various times had encounters & ultimate collisions with 'moon' category sized rocks/objects.
The high speed death spiral between two intercircling objects/rocks/planets may be why both Earth & Mars spin on about a 24 hour cycle.
[might be informative if scientists could determine if Mars had its current spin before the object it was involved with actually crashed into it, or otherwise how & when that happened.]

Since there isn't much to preserve on the current surface of Venus, while a binary circling spin object sounds radical it might be the most pragmatic & workable, provided we understood all the expected results & designed it correctly. Then one could supply most the organics from crashing low density comets into it afterwards.

That temporary encircling object around [the relatively smaller] Mars is also what is credited by some with moltenizing its core, because of the tidal pressure & friction.

Our own moon's tidal effects may be contributing to the energy/friction to keep our own Earth's core molten.

Getting a distant [moon-sized?] object way early in its orbit one may be able to just nudge its trajectory just enough so that it entangles with Venus, without of course disturbing Earth [or anything else significant] in the process.

Just like keeping an asteroid from hitting the Earth is best done by very small adjustments in that object's path way ahead of intersection,
the converse of using that same strategy to get something to encircle & perhaps crash into Venus might apply. One would be talking about a much bigger object encircling/crashing into Venus, although perhaps a well planned series of smaller objects might work, & perhaps work even better.

We could do small objects first to learn the art/skill/science of it, then go on to larger ones to complete that task.
Then finish the job using comets to get the right surface chemistry/chemicals [H20, CO2, N2, O2]. Of course they could come in other forms like ammonia NH3, methane CH4 etc.
We could take Pluto and Charon out of their orbit—since they don't matter anymore—and hit Venus from opposite sides. Charon would have to be moving faster because its smaller and this would equal out the forces. If we do it just right, Venus would get the extra mass it needs to match Earth's gravity as well as a moon for tides.

[disrupter]

I was thinking about Mars too.
If we hit it with a large amount of mass it might re-engender the moltenization of its core.

before we do too much of this preparation for terraforming we need to know better how much our moon or any largish moon plays in keeping the core of a planet molten. If the tides of the ocean rise several feet every 12 hours, while rocks may be denser & more structural, all that torsion has to be adding to friction, stress & heat to keep the core molten.

In any event, maybe what we need is what happened here on Earth to happen with Venus,
namely that a very large object crash into it, both to get it spinning, add some mass & leave it with a moon to help keep its core molten.

Similarly we might do something with Mars, to add a lot of mass & a more significant sized moon [than the two it currently has] to keep its core molten.
It may have been that object that was orbiting Mars [& eventually crashed] that contributed [or solely caused?] its core to previously be molten.

note: it almost certainly requires a stronger magnetic field, the closer you are to the sun, because as the solar wind spreads out it becomes weaker.
That might imply that for Venus we might even want a shorter day than 24 hours.

On a serious note, with potentially [inevitably?] violent collisions we would have to be aware of & prepared to mitigate the risks of projectile debris hitting things [like Earth or other installations] we want to preserve/protect. I am not sure if you could create the spin without an actual collision, but i am no physicist or mathematician.

On Mars a 24 day might be superfluous, but that wouldn't be a problem if it made it more agreeably habitable.

I have the vision of 10 quasi Earth-like planets, each with a moon, orbiting the Sun, lol.
[as long as their gravitational interactions didn't create any orbit decay/problem]

[Crazy Mike]

I was thinking about Mars too.
If we hit it with a large amount of mass it might re-engender the moltenization of its core.

before we do too much of this preparation for terraforming we need to know better how much our moon or any largish moon plays in keeping the core of a planet molten. If the tides of the ocean rise several feet every 12 hours, while rocks may be denser & more structural, all that torsion has to be adding to friction, stress & heat to keep the core molten.

In any event, maybe what we need is what happened here on Earth to happen with Venus,
namely that a very large object crash into it, both to get it spinning, add some mass & leave it with a moon to help keep its core molten.

Similarly we might do something with Mars, to add a lot of mass & a more significant sized moon [than the two it currently has] to keep its core molten.
It may have been that object that was orbiting Mars [& eventually crashed] that contributed [or solely caused?] its core to previously be molten.

note: it almost certainly requires a stronger magnetic field, the closer you are to the sun, because as the solar wind spreads out it becomes weaker.
That might imply that for Venus we might even want a shorter day than 24 hours.

On a serious note, with potentially [inevitably?] violent collisions we would have to be aware of & prepared to mitigate the risks of projectile debris hitting things [like Earth or other installations] we want to preserve/protect. I am not sure if you could create the spin without an actual collision, but i am no physicist or mathematician.

On Mars a 24 day might be superfluous, but that wouldn't be a problem if it made it more agreeably habitable.

I have the vision of 10 quasi Earth-like planets, each with a moon, orbiting the Sun, lol.
[as long as their gravitational interactions didn't create any orbit decay/problem]You aren't really serious are you?

Do you have any idea how much energy would be required to do something like speed up the rotation of Venus? Have you tried calculating it?

What would you do afterwards? It is far too hot on Venus to maintain water and the atmosphere is incredibly dense and almost all CO2. How could you possibly terra-form that?

Same with Mars, it is far too cold and has a very thin CO2 atmosphere. How are you going to deal with that?

[disrupter]

First of all, a small adjustment of an already orbiting [or non-orbiting? ie. oort cloud?] body only takes a small steady nudge if you calculate its trajectory over an extended time frame.

secondly to get the proper organic chemicals/atoms [atmosphere, water etc] you could send low density comets their way, which are largely dirty snowballs.

Oh yea of little imagination, lol.

Impoverishment is thine.

[gOd]

First of all, a small adjustment of an already orbiting [or non-orbiting? ie. oort cloud?] body only takes a small steady nudge if you calculate its trajectory over an extended time frame.

secondly to get the proper organic chemicals/atoms [atmosphere, water etc] you could send low density comets their way, which are largely dirty snowballs.

Oh yea of little imagination, lol.

Impoverishment is thine.
We could also send Wall Street criminals there to add to the carbon cycle.

[disrupter]

Yeah the wall street criminals get sent there ahead of time,

if they survive, LOL, they are considered pardoned.

[Crazy Mike]

First of all, a small adjustment of an already orbiting [or non-orbiting? ie. oort cloud?] body only takes a small steady nudge if you calculate its trajectory over an extended time frame.You could move it's orbit over a long period of time with small adjustments. But it would take a long long time. Actually speeding up its rotation is another matter, it would require a massive amount of energy.

secondly to get the proper organic chemicals/atoms [atmosphere, water etc] you could send low density comets their way, which are largely dirty snowballs.The water would all boil away in a rather short period of time. The surface temperature of Venus is 460˚C

Oh yea of little imagination, lol.

Impoverishment is thine.Oh yea lacking facts about Venus.

[gOd]

You could move it's orbit over a long period of time with small adjustments. But it would take a long long time. Actually speeding up its rotation is another matter, it would require a massive amount of energy.

The water would all boil away in a rather short period of time. The surface temperature of Venus is 460˚C

Oh yea lacking facts about Venus.
You're looking at this problem through 20th century eyes. If we pulled all the carbon based molecules out of the atmosphere by converting the gases into liquids and solids on the surface, the temperature would dramatically decrease thereby allowing liquid H2O to form a stable water cycle.

[Crazy Mike]

You're looking at this problem through 20th century eyes. If we pulled all the carbon based molecules out of the atmosphere by converting the gases into liquids and solids on the surface, the temperature would dramatically decrease thereby allowing liquid H2O to form a stable water cycle.How do you pull all the carbon based molecules out of the atmosphere?

[gOd]

How do you pull all the carbon based molecules out of the atmosphere?
Genetically engineered bacteria.

[Crazy Mike]

Genetically engineered bacteria.That can survive at 460C and 90 atmospheres of pressure?

How long is this going to take? 1,000,000 years?

Venus is still too hot to maintain much liquid water for long.

[CosmicRocker]

How do you pull all the carbon based molecules out of the atmosphere?
Tax them ! :lmao2:

[Crazy Mike]

Tax them ! :lmao2:Works for me. 1 cent a tonne sounds like a fair rate.

[Bill Cosby]

Genetically engineered bacteria.

What are your feelings on genetic engineering??

The crossing of various organisms & then releasing them into the environment to interact w/ the rest of the planet………

[gOd]

What are your feelings on genetic engineering??

The crossing of various organisms & then releasing them into the environment to interact w/ the rest of the planet………
On a planet which harbors no life...I say, "Go for it!"

[Mr, gone]

What are your feelings on genetic engineering??

The crossing of various organisms & then releasing them into the environment to interact w/ the rest of the planet………

Isn't this similar to what Scientologists preach happened to us? Aliens planted us here millions of years ago (maybe with a bible) as an experiment? Or some shit like that...:lmao2: